Mango84
Thank you for your information . The newest application of blue light for oral treatment is Blue light toothbrush , so there is no question that the low intense blue light is safe to be used in the mouth . It has 1 or 2 LED and is supplied by 2 AA , that means the blue light of the Ultrablu toothbrush is more intense than the 21 LED flashlight which is supplied by only 3 AAA . I am thinking that maybe the 21 LED flashlight is not intense enough to have an effect on the BPB( black pigmented bacteria ) , so may be we have to use it longer
each time , 3' or more or put it nearer to the surface of the tongue or we have to connect it to a 12v power supply. The 21 LED has advantage of covering a larger area on the tongue .
About the effectiveness of the blue light therapy , we are experiment it and time will tell .
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alright, i bit the bullet, i bought it..its shipping
i have doubts about this becuase even if we kill the bacteria in our mouth i still believe its just another form of masking. if it works and we kill the bacteria in the mouth, bad bacteria will still be in our stomach, intenstines, liver, etc going to our mouth
i've waited 5 pages for some people to report back but no one really stepped up.
i plan to use this and report back (no disappearing)
i'd like to note that i have mild bad breath. meaning it doesn't fill a room, but is within talking distance.
i have doubts about this becuase even if we kill the bacteria in our mouth i still believe its just another form of masking. if it works and we kill the bacteria in the mouth, bad bacteria will still be in our stomach, intenstines, liver, etc going to our mouth
i've waited 5 pages for some people to report back but no one really stepped up.
i plan to use this and report back (no disappearing)
i'd like to note that i have mild bad breath. meaning it doesn't fill a room, but is within talking distance.
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halitosisux
- Moderator
- Posts: 3339
- Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2008 1:29 pm
bhd, I think the concept behind this is that, presuming the theory is actually able to work inside the mouth the way its been described to, and is able to reduce only the kinds of bacteria that are established as the culprits for causing BB, and thereby encouraging a shift of the oral flora balance to one which is more favourable in BB terms, rather than any broad short-term bacterial blitzing with mouthwashes and antibiotics etc - If it can be made to work, and according to the theory behind it and the results from sadman so far, there is no reason why it shouldnt, then its potentially a very hopeful solution for those who suffer the kind of BB you have described.
Any potential dangers of high intensity coherant blue light has to be weighed up against the other physical and chemical bombardments we've all been prepared to put our mouthes through, the proven cancer risks of alcohol etc, and surely nothing compares to the mental and health implications of enduring a single day of BB hell.
So good luck with yours.
Any potential dangers of high intensity coherant blue light has to be weighed up against the other physical and chemical bombardments we've all been prepared to put our mouthes through, the proven cancer risks of alcohol etc, and surely nothing compares to the mental and health implications of enduring a single day of BB hell.
So good luck with yours.
Sadman
Thank you for your prompt reply. I think im going to buy the toothbrush as it is readily available in the uk. If I order the crime scene torch I have to pay an excess of $70 for shipping alone. Thats money I cant afford at the moment.
Please keep us updated on the progress you make.
If anyone is using the Blulight toothbrush, please let us know of your experience.
Thank you for your prompt reply. I think im going to buy the toothbrush as it is readily available in the uk. If I order the crime scene torch I have to pay an excess of $70 for shipping alone. Thats money I cant afford at the moment.
Please keep us updated on the progress you make.
If anyone is using the Blulight toothbrush, please let us know of your experience.
Photodestruction of bacterial cultures.
The effects of increasing light doses from the light source on cultures of BPB are shown in Fig. 2. P. intermedia and P. nigrescens were completely killed by exposure to light with a fluence of 4.2 J/cm2 (1 min of irradiation). P. melaninogenica was reduced by 70% by exposure to 4.2 J/cm2 (P 0.008) and completely killed by exposure to 21 J/cm2 (5 min of irradiation). The P. gingivalis survival fractions were 77.25% (P 0.001), 12.55% (P 0.00002), and 1.48% (P 0.000001) after exposure to light with fluences of 4.2, 21, and 42 J/cm2, respectively. S. constellatus,a nonpigmented species, was unaffected by irradiation (data not shown).
HPLC analysis. HPLC revealed that BPB expressed different
porphyrin patterns (Fig. 3). The percent porphyrin content
in BPB is shown in Table 2. The amounts of porphyrin were
267, 47, 41, and 2.2 ng/mg of protein in P. intermedia, P. nigrescens,
P. melaninogenica, and P. gingivalis, respectively.
In healthy subjects, dental plaque remains stable for prolonged
periods of time because of a dynamic balance among
the resident members of its microbial community (15). A major
disturbance of the local habitat can cause a breakdown of this
microbial homeostasis that may lead to enrichment of the
microbial community by pathogens (13, 14). The primary goal
of a strategy for disease prevention and control should be
specific suppression of key pathogens, such as P. gingivalis,
which may result in an increase in the microbial flora that is
associated with health. The specific hypothesis of this study was that blue light could achieve a rapid and selective elimination of oral BPB by exciting their endogenous porphyrins.
Inactivation of oral BPB, such as P. intermedia and P. gingivalis,by visible light from an argon laser (wavelength range,488 to 514 nm) (6, 7) and a helium-neon laser (wavelength, 633nm) (9) at high-energy fluences ranging from 200 to 360 J/cm2 has been reported previously. The 380- to 520-nm spectral range of light used in our studies matches the strongest porphyrin photoexcitation band at 405 to 415 nm and a small band at 505 nm (27). The green and red lights used in the abovementioned studies (6, 7, 9) targeted only two small absorption peaks of endogenous porphyrins, and thus high-energy flu-ences were required to achieve bacterial inactivation. Blue light has also been used for eradication of Propionibacterium acnes, the gram-positive species that causes acne (1, 21), which produces endogenous porphyrins (mainly coproporphyrin and PpIX) that absorb energy in the near-UV and blue parts of the light spectrum (8, 10, 16, 17). A significant improvement in inflammatory lesions of patients with acne vulgaris after exposure to blue light with peaks at 405 and 420 nm has been demonstrated (21). However, the cumulative energy fluences used (320 J/cm2) were much higher than those in our studies When dental plaque samples from human subjects were irradiated, P. melaninogenica showed the highest susceptibility to light, followed by P. nigrescens, P. intermedia, and P. gingivalis
All of the Prevotella species showed similar patterns
of susceptibility to light, with growth inhibition ratios
ranging between 2.1 (4.2 J/cm2) and 3.4 (21 J/cm2). The growth of P. gingivalis was inhibited 1.4 (4.2 J/cm2) to 1.9 (21 J/cm2) times. These data are in accordance with those obtained in a previous study in which exposure of human subgingival plaque samples to red light at 633 nm led to 60 and 40% elimination of Prevotella species and P. gingivalis, respectively (9). However, the energy fluence delivered to the species was 360 J/cm2 since the red light corresponded to the long-wavelength absorption maximum of porphyrins. The same study demonstrated
a reduction in the number of CFU of other anaerobic
and aerobic dental plaque microorganisms by 50% as a result
of their exposure to red light (9). In our study, the reduction of
CFU in dental plaque samples was 25% (Fig. 4) after exposure to light with an energy fluence of 21 J/cm2. The microbial analysis showed that the growth of the remaining 36 taxa was suppressed 1.5 times at both energy fluences whereas the growth of all four BPB was inhibited 2 to 2.8 times (Fig. 6).
Some of these non-black-pigmented species may also contain
porphyrins and/or other cell pigments, which can explain their
susceptibility to light.
These data suggest that visible light could be used prophylactically to stabilize the normal microbial composition of plaque by suppressing potentially pathogenic BPB. Compared with other forms of periodontal therapy (scaling, mouthwashes,surgery), this form of treatment would offer many advantages; it is painless, rapid, and devoid of drug toxicity; has no effect on taste; and is selective in its effect.
The effects of increasing light doses from the light source on cultures of BPB are shown in Fig. 2. P. intermedia and P. nigrescens were completely killed by exposure to light with a fluence of 4.2 J/cm2 (1 min of irradiation). P. melaninogenica was reduced by 70% by exposure to 4.2 J/cm2 (P 0.008) and completely killed by exposure to 21 J/cm2 (5 min of irradiation). The P. gingivalis survival fractions were 77.25% (P 0.001), 12.55% (P 0.00002), and 1.48% (P 0.000001) after exposure to light with fluences of 4.2, 21, and 42 J/cm2, respectively. S. constellatus,a nonpigmented species, was unaffected by irradiation (data not shown).
HPLC analysis. HPLC revealed that BPB expressed different
porphyrin patterns (Fig. 3). The percent porphyrin content
in BPB is shown in Table 2. The amounts of porphyrin were
267, 47, 41, and 2.2 ng/mg of protein in P. intermedia, P. nigrescens,
P. melaninogenica, and P. gingivalis, respectively.
In healthy subjects, dental plaque remains stable for prolonged
periods of time because of a dynamic balance among
the resident members of its microbial community (15). A major
disturbance of the local habitat can cause a breakdown of this
microbial homeostasis that may lead to enrichment of the
microbial community by pathogens (13, 14). The primary goal
of a strategy for disease prevention and control should be
specific suppression of key pathogens, such as P. gingivalis,
which may result in an increase in the microbial flora that is
associated with health. The specific hypothesis of this study was that blue light could achieve a rapid and selective elimination of oral BPB by exciting their endogenous porphyrins.
Inactivation of oral BPB, such as P. intermedia and P. gingivalis,by visible light from an argon laser (wavelength range,488 to 514 nm) (6, 7) and a helium-neon laser (wavelength, 633nm) (9) at high-energy fluences ranging from 200 to 360 J/cm2 has been reported previously. The 380- to 520-nm spectral range of light used in our studies matches the strongest porphyrin photoexcitation band at 405 to 415 nm and a small band at 505 nm (27). The green and red lights used in the abovementioned studies (6, 7, 9) targeted only two small absorption peaks of endogenous porphyrins, and thus high-energy flu-ences were required to achieve bacterial inactivation. Blue light has also been used for eradication of Propionibacterium acnes, the gram-positive species that causes acne (1, 21), which produces endogenous porphyrins (mainly coproporphyrin and PpIX) that absorb energy in the near-UV and blue parts of the light spectrum (8, 10, 16, 17). A significant improvement in inflammatory lesions of patients with acne vulgaris after exposure to blue light with peaks at 405 and 420 nm has been demonstrated (21). However, the cumulative energy fluences used (320 J/cm2) were much higher than those in our studies When dental plaque samples from human subjects were irradiated, P. melaninogenica showed the highest susceptibility to light, followed by P. nigrescens, P. intermedia, and P. gingivalis
All of the Prevotella species showed similar patterns
of susceptibility to light, with growth inhibition ratios
ranging between 2.1 (4.2 J/cm2) and 3.4 (21 J/cm2). The growth of P. gingivalis was inhibited 1.4 (4.2 J/cm2) to 1.9 (21 J/cm2) times. These data are in accordance with those obtained in a previous study in which exposure of human subgingival plaque samples to red light at 633 nm led to 60 and 40% elimination of Prevotella species and P. gingivalis, respectively (9). However, the energy fluence delivered to the species was 360 J/cm2 since the red light corresponded to the long-wavelength absorption maximum of porphyrins. The same study demonstrated
a reduction in the number of CFU of other anaerobic
and aerobic dental plaque microorganisms by 50% as a result
of their exposure to red light (9). In our study, the reduction of
CFU in dental plaque samples was 25% (Fig. 4) after exposure to light with an energy fluence of 21 J/cm2. The microbial analysis showed that the growth of the remaining 36 taxa was suppressed 1.5 times at both energy fluences whereas the growth of all four BPB was inhibited 2 to 2.8 times (Fig. 6).
Some of these non-black-pigmented species may also contain
porphyrins and/or other cell pigments, which can explain their
susceptibility to light.
These data suggest that visible light could be used prophylactically to stabilize the normal microbial composition of plaque by suppressing potentially pathogenic BPB. Compared with other forms of periodontal therapy (scaling, mouthwashes,surgery), this form of treatment would offer many advantages; it is painless, rapid, and devoid of drug toxicity; has no effect on taste; and is selective in its effect.
I ordered a wireless dental led curing light lamp, it has blue light, wavelenth is 420nm-480nm & Accumulator voltage & capacity 3.7v/2000mAh from ebay.
I'm going to try it and see if this kills the black pigmented bacteria cause that is exactly what I have. I was diagnose with mild chronic periodontis, my gums dont look to bad, pockets are 3,4 but the back of the gums are swallon filled with infection. Hopefully it works, If this doesnt work than I'm looking into Perio laser, lanp...or flap surgery..not even shr which one will be better. I just hope this works.
Keep everyone in my Prayers.
I'm going to try it and see if this kills the black pigmented bacteria cause that is exactly what I have. I was diagnose with mild chronic periodontis, my gums dont look to bad, pockets are 3,4 but the back of the gums are swallon filled with infection. Hopefully it works, If this doesnt work than I'm looking into Perio laser, lanp...or flap surgery..not even shr which one will be better. I just hope this works.
Keep everyone in my Prayers.
The cause of bad breath is an imbalance of the mouth flora where the bad bacteria ( VSC producing ) for some reason ( antibiotic use , decreased immune system , Oral pH ...) outgrow the good bacteria . The principle of Blue light therapy is to use blue light to kill the bad bacteria and as a result the good bacteria increase and gradually restore the healthy normal flora . The blue light can be used for a longer time to continuously suppress the growth of the bad bacteria not like antibiotic such as Metronidazole which can be used for 10 days as a maximumelliott wrote:Perhaps I'm misunderstanding, but if you indeed kill the bacteria in the mouth, what stops it from coming back? (I'd like to swallow one of the blue lights...)
I am intrigued though. Waiting to hear more! Good luck with it.
Irradiation means exposing to light source , not laser . The blue LED flashlight has the right wavelength , but does it have the right irradiance ( mW/cm2) to kill the BPB? . That's what we have to find out as well as the time to use the light ( 2'-10' ?, j/cm2? ) , the distance from the light to the tongue ( to increase the irradiance) the treatment time ( how long do we need to use the light for the oral flora to become normal), the synergetic effect of blue light with H2O2 .....meowkity1 wrote:tHAT BIG LONG POST SADMAN POSTED SAYS THEY USED LASORS. sO iM WONDERING IF THE FLASHLIGHT WILL WORK. aLTHOUGH ITS 450 NM
.
What's your progress so far ?
I have my fingers crossed on this and hope that you guys can come to a conclusion that it makes a difference.sadman wrote:The cause of bad breath is an imbalance of the mouth flora where the bad bacteria ( VSC producing ) for some reason ( antibiotic use , decreased immune system , Oral pH ...) outgrow the good bacteria . The principle of Blue light therapy is to use blue light to kill the bad bacteria and as a result the good bacteria increase and gradually restore the healthy normal flora . The blue light can be used for a longer time to continuously suppress the growth of the bad bacteria not like antibiotic such as Metronidazole which can be used for 10 days as a maximumelliott wrote:Perhaps I'm misunderstanding, but if you indeed kill the bacteria in the mouth, what stops it from coming back? (I'd like to swallow one of the blue lights...
I am intrigued though. Waiting to hear more! Good luck with it.
I think that oral imbalance is certainly one cause (and probably the majority), but from reading around, I think some have internal issues that produce foul exhaled air from the stomach or lungs.
Still if this can make even a 20% difference, it's worth it.
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snoopsister
- Sheriff
- Posts: 304
- Joined: Tue Mar 06, 2007 7:12 am
The wireless dental curing light might be the right light source since it has a density of 1000mW/cm2 to 2000mW/cm2 which we can adjust by changing the distance from the tongue to the light . I will buy one to test myselfsandy wrote:I ordered a wireless dental led curing light lamp, it has blue light, wavelenth is 420nm-480nm & Accumulator voltage & capacity 3.7v/2000mAh from ebay.
I'm going to try it and see if this kills the black pigmented bacteria cause that is exactly what I have. I was diagnose with mild chronic periodontis, my gums dont look to bad, pockets are 3,4 but the back of the gums are swallon filled with infection. Hopefully it works, If this doesnt work than I'm looking into Perio laser, lanp...or flap surgery..not even shr which one will be better. I just hope this works.
Keep everyone in my Prayers.
Right now , the flashlight is sill working good for me . My tongue is pinker and smoother than ever , so there is no doubt that the Blue light works , but we need to find which light source has the right intensity for every situation including some hard to treat condition such as hairy tongue
