for aydinmur

iva · Post by **iva** » Thu May 20, 2010 6:57 am

Halitosisux,

once again u are absoultely right and I totally agree with u -

"In other words, a "normal" ecology gives a "normal" profile of bacterial composition, i.e one which does not give bad breath, and vice versa with an "abnormal" ecology.
And, so there is always a reason, relating to ecology, that causes bad breath, and its all about finding out that reason. As simple as that..."

I have developed that theory many times and I personally know that is my problem - my ecology has changed and I `m "lucky" enough to know exactly why.
My silent reflux, which reaches my pharynx, makes the tissues of the throat secrete thick mucous to protect themselves from reflux. That thick mucous is a perfect environment for bacteria to develop and thrive.
I know that I have to stop reflux first and then work on ecology, it`s as simple as that

br · Post by br » Thu May 20, 2010 11:28 am

aydinmur wrote:
halitosisux wrote:Are there really certain specific species of bacteria that reside in people with chronic BB and not in those who dont? If this is true then isnt this where attention needs to be focused? Is it not possible to permanently "change" the composition of microbial flora once its been established?
Yep.!
This is my interesting area. You always ask good questions.
I if someones dont stop me. Im compressing all information into one sentence:

In order to permanently alter their profile and nature we must change ecology. This is the key.

Murat,
I would also like to hear the lecture. Its interesting. Thanks.

halitosisux · Post by **halitosisux** » Thu May 20, 2010 8:42 pm

Thanx iva, I know you'll get there eventually with your reflux issue, and I hope you find you were right about the cause of your BB.

Iva, just out of curiousity, do you get heartburn and the taste of acid in your mouth and throat?

A few weeks ago I had a heavy late night meal and half way through the night I woke up suddenly choking on what tasted like pure battery acid. I was so alarmed I instinctively forced it back down rather than allow it into my mouth. That has never happened to me before.

Renato · Post by **Renato** » Fri May 21, 2010 3:08 am

Hi Iva, that is exactly what is happening with me. My silent reflux (not burning), which is real for me, but not observed by doctors, alters the bacterial ecology everyday in my esophagus, throat and mouth, perhaps sinuses too.

I feel this metallic taste from the back of my throat and worse on mornings or when lying down.

I found from the "reflux forum" about the "Gaviscon Advance" product, which contains sodium alginate and appears to only be sold outside of the US. It supposed to stop silent reflux by creating a tampon in the sphincter between stomach and esophagus avoiding fluids to go up through throat and mouth.

Have you ever tried it?

If so, did it work?

PR1988 · Post by **PR1988** » Fri May 21, 2010 4:44 am

@iva @Renato

both suffer bb because silent reflux am i correct, are ya able to smell your own breath?

iva · Post by **iva** » Fri May 21, 2010 6:42 am

Halitosisux,

Thank u for the kind words, I do hope I`ll be able to fix it some day, not without the help of people like Aydin Murat..

I do not get the burning sensation because I take Nexium and control it, but I do get a sour metallic displeasant taste in my mouth.

Renato, I have tried Gaviscon and it doesn`t work for me, in fact nothing stops my reflux, it`s just some diet and less food that lessen it somehow.

PR1988, yes I suffer silent reflux, I am not sure about smelling my own breath but I can smell the dorsum of my hand when I lick it.

halitosisux · Post by **halitosisux** » Fri May 21, 2010 10:18 am

Hi Iva, yes maybe it only takes a small amount of reflux with even small quantities of stomach acid contained in it, or even just the vapours from the stomach as you say as occurs with silent reflux, to affect the natural bacterial ecology.

Aydinmur said something interesting, on natural leakage of gas from the stomach, that there is always a certain amount that leaks even in people without any reflux problems. So its not like the stomach is a perfect seal even for healthy people. So for those who have reflux this must be much worse and lead to some consequences.

Iva, do you get heartburn and the symptoms of actual acid reflux if you dont take your meds?

iva · Post by **iva** » Fri May 21, 2010 10:54 am

Hi Hali,

no I never get heartburn, even when I had erosive GERD. That`t the idea of silent reflux - u don`t get the usual symptoms of reflux, the reflux affects and has it`s manifestation only in the laryngopharingeal area (and the mouth obviously)

What I don`t get is whether zinc can alter permanently the flora in the mouth or it only works temporarily and helps mask the symptoms..

PR1988 · Post by **PR1988** » Fri May 21, 2010 5:41 pm

@iva

and when you smell your wrist is a really foul smell, could you describe it to me.
sorry for askin to many question but i think i have the same problem =(

Renato · Post by **Renato** » Sat May 22, 2010 5:06 pm

PR1988 wrote:@iva @Renato

both suffer bb because silent reflux am i correct, are ya able to smell your own breath?

Im not able to smell my own BB, but I know my breath stinks based on the reaction of everybody. Sometimes it is worst, (people really cover their noses). when this occurs, my bad taste is also worst.

What I noticed is that the test of "licking the wrist" also give me bad smell. It smells as wet putrefacted garbage. However, there is not smell on this test after scrapping and rinsing with H2O2(gargling and tongue), but BB persists (based on people's reactions).

Renato · Post by **Renato** » Sat May 22, 2010 5:20 pm

Iva and PR1988 , guys do you also suspect of bad nose odor?

I never looked into my nose odor before, but now Im getting paranoid, I think some mid odor also coming from my nose. Almost sure was not there before. Just having my mouth shut up no rections on people, but now I think they react with my mouth closed.
I think it started after trying nose washes.Perhpas I spread bacteria into my sinuses.

I need to verify this with somebody reliable.

It is going to be even more depressive if I should hold my breath now.

trouble · Post by **trouble** » Sun May 23, 2010 4:04 am

yesterday my husband told me i had nose odor. but he couldnt classify it (i had mouth-odor too, but he told me it was different). i didnt smell it myself and am becoming very paranoid. i always took for granted at least my nose-breath has no odor...

aydinmur · Post by **aydinmur** » Sun May 23, 2010 12:46 pm

trouble wrote:yesterday my husband told me i had nose odor. but he couldnt classify it (i had mouth-odor too, but he told me it was different). i didnt smell it myself and am becoming very paranoid. i always took for granted at least my nose-breath has no odor...

My understand you try to distinguish type 1-2 halitosis. (mouth-nose odors)

Two questions to you:
1- Do you feel bad odor while your mouth is closed?
(Type 2 and 4 patients reply "yes", while Type 1 and 3 "no")

p.s.: remember; an individual may have type 1,2,3,4,5 at the same time.

2- Do you feel bad odor when you sneeze ?
(only type 2 patients say "yes", others "no")

There are more evidences to distinguish type 1 and 2 halitosis, but requires comparison medical findings and evaluation.

trouble · Post by **trouble** » Sun May 23, 2010 4:56 pm

dear aydinmur:

1) i feel bad odor when my mouth is closed, but more like tasting it on the tonge, or having it in my pharynx. hard to explain

sometimes i feel/taste normal, but smell something when exhaling in the nose-direction.

2) i dont feel or smell anything when sneezing.

PR1988 · Post by **PR1988** » Tue May 25, 2010 5:58 pm

Renato wrote:Iva and PR1988 , guys do you also suspect of bad nose odor?

i dont suspect it. but who knows maybe it does exist. once i ask one of my lil sister to smell the air coming out my nose she said it didnt smell. but i dont know if she was being honest?

do you have the lump in throat symptom with your silent reflux?