why does the ****ing middle third of my tongue still smell?

[cool]

maybe you scrab your tongue too often with too much force

[danger]

maybe you scrab your tongue too often with too much force

i dont scrape my tongue anymore. i stopped about a year ago. and i know tongue scraping never caused this because i had them before i even started tongue scraping

i think it is this type of bad breath where dentists and doctors tell you you will just have to live with it, because short of chopping your tongue off there is no way round it

[cool]

i just came across this, dunno if its helpfull to you as i didnt had the time to watch it full...and eventhough it is old it was posted on a german bb board so i figured it might not be complete useless

www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1lyFPUIkfE]]

[halitosisux]

Danger, I'm not totally sure which type of zinc is the most effective, I think its zinc chloride. I think zinc acts both to neutralize the odours and also to inhibit the ability of bacteria to produce VSCs, so the effect lasts longer than something which just kills the bacteria and then disturbs the oral flora. Yes the zinc needs to come into contact with the tongue surface and the bacteria on there. You could try various zinc combinations.

Another option for you is to have your breath odours and gases analysed. If you dont get someone else's opinion you will forever be wondering.

Another important cause of odour buildup on the tongue is the actual tongue surface itself. Some people have a deeper than normal groove along the centre where anaerobic bacteria are able to proliferate and produce odours. Some people simply have longer than normal tongue papillae or for various reasons the keratin and dead cells of the ends of the papillae dont slough away normally so they build up and form a coating. This increases the effective anaerobic area of the tongue and the overall production of VSCs. Look into all of these. There may be biological reasons such as hormones that regulate this.

I found out recently that when I take vitamin C supplements my facial stubble becomes less course and easier to shave compared to when I dont. There might be some connection here as to why vitamin C is know to help reduce BB, because the ends of the papillae contain keratin, as do our nails and hair and it may reduce the tongue coating for the same reasons. Its a possibility. There are other supplements that seem to have a definite effect on the thickness of the tongue coating (I think vitamin B12). It could be this simple, a malabsorption or digestive problem to throw the whole body out in this way, requiring supplementation.

Aydinmur also mentioned some ongoing developments with lasers that can permanently reduce the length of the tongue papillae. Not sure whether there's any kind of surgery to deal with deep tongue grooves.

I think the tongue grows with us and undergoes subtle changes in characteristics as we age. The ears and nose never stop growing, maybe the tongue doesnt either? Eyes dont change size from the moment we're born.

Danger, you could try using some form of irrigation on your tongue using zinc, as opposed to any form of scraping or brushing which only triggers the growth of a thicker coating. Any chemicals that kill bacteria only lead to the emergence of resistant bacteria and you are back to where you started.

[danger]

i just came across this, dunno if its helpfull to you as i didnt had the time to watch it full...and eventhough it is old it was posted on a german bb board so i figured it might not be complete useless

www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1lyFPUIkfE]]

interesting video. i dont think mines is as thick or mouldy as that guy, though my coating is on a similar part of the tongue. also, they dont mention whether the guy has bad breath.

though they did mention antibiotics. i took a course of antibiotics about 8 years ago for acne

[danger]

Danger, I'm not totally sure which type of zinc is the most effective, I think its zinc chloride. I think zinc acts both to neutralize the odours and also to inhibit the ability of bacteria to produce VSCs, so the effect lasts longer than something which just kills the bacteria and then disturbs the oral flora. Yes the zinc needs to come into contact with the tongue surface and the bacteria on there. You could try various zinc combinations.

Another option for you is to have your breath odours and gases analysed. If you dont get someone else's opinion you will forever be wondering.

Another important cause of odour buildup on the tongue is the actual tongue surface itself. Some people have a deeper than normal groove along the centre where anaerobic bacteria are able to proliferate and produce odours. Some people simply have longer than normal tongue papillae or for various reasons the keratin and dead cells of the ends of the papillae dont slough away normally so they build up and form a coating. This increases the effective anaerobic area of the tongue and the overall production of VSCs. Look into all of these. There may be biological reasons such as hormones that regulate this.

I found out recently that when I take vitamin C supplements my facial stubble becomes less course and easier to shave compared to when I dont. There might be some connection here as to why vitamin C is know to help reduce BB, because the ends of the papillae contain keratin, as do our nails and hair and it may reduce the tongue coating for the same reasons. Its a possibility. There are other supplements that seem to have a definite effect on the thickness of the tongue coating (I think vitamin B12). It could be this simple, a malabsorption or digestive problem to throw the whole body out in this way, requiring supplementation.

Aydinmur also mentioned some ongoing developments with lasers that can permanently reduce the length of the tongue papillae. Not sure whether there's any kind of surgery to deal with deep tongue grooves.

I think the tongue grows with us and undergoes subtle changes in characteristics as we age. The ears and nose never stop growing, maybe the tongue doesnt either? Eyes dont change size from the moment we're born.

Danger, you could try using some form of irrigation on your tongue using zinc, as opposed to any form of scraping or brushing which only triggers the growth of a thicker coating. Any chemicals that kill bacteria only lead to the emergence of resistant bacteria and you are back to where you started.

what sort of zinc could i use that comes into contact with the tongue? obviously certain types of toothpaste and mouthwashes wont

do you mean one of those halimeter tests? would they be accurate for type 1 bad breath?

also, would eating foods with are supposed to help bad breath, like apples and celery, be helpful for for targeting type 1?

[halitosisux]

Some toothpastes and mouthwashes contain Zinc, usually Zinc chloride.

Using a trusted volunteer/helper, and a professional tongue scraper and some mouthwash containing Zinc, you can find out whether or not this odour on your tongue is making your breath smell bad. Scraping your tongue and gargling with this mouthwash will temporarily get rid of any odour there that might be making your breath smell bad.
You could also try chlorine dioxide to assist with this.
Get your helper to test your breath before and after.
If you cant get anyone to do this for you then you could try speaking to your dentist about it and asking if they'll be willing to help you with such an assessment.

Aydinmur also said something about cysteine (i have no clue what this is) but he said if you have type 1 BB it will temporarily make it a lot worse. Another way of confirming type 1 BB. But it probably needs someone with experience to be able to use this to make any kind of objective assessment.

As far as equipement for diagnostic testing, a halimeter is designed to test for certain types of gases that are commonly associated with having BB. An oral chroma test can tell you which gases are present and in what concentrations, but again, as far as I know its only for gases commonly found to be present in bad breath. There is probably more known about the gases of Jupiter than breath gases.

Apples are known to be good because apart from the pure washing effect from eating one, apples contain some kind of antibacterial properties. Probably why raw foods work too, because of their direct action in the mouth, because antibacterial properties and enzymes are not damaged by the cooking process.

[Phantasist]

Halitosisux,
You're saying that antibacterial properties and enzymes are NOT damaged by the cooking process?

[halitosisux]

Phantasist, yes this is what I've read and heard of. I hope I'm reading your question correctly.

[danger]

sux, i know you think that scraping your tongue alot can only add to the problem, but what about just using your finger?

if i have been at work most of the day, for example, and then i do the finger test on my tongue in the evening, then the smell on my finger is not too bad. it still has an odour if i let my finger dry though

but if i am at home all day i cant help doing the finger test numerous times during the day. i am just wondering if me constantly doing this makes it worse

and i dont know why but when i blow my nose i sometimes get a bad taste in my mouth. i am sure it has nothing to do with my nose because if i keep my mouth shut while blowing my nose i detect no smell whatsoever. also i notice my breath feels worse when i am in the shower, i can only assume that my mouth gets very dry when i am in the shower

[halitosisux]

Danger, I dont think rubbing your finger on your tongue will have any detrimental effect. When we eat we're scraping our tongues constantly. Lightly scraping the tongue is good, but its when you hear of people spending 30 minutes obsessively scraping and repeating and using chemicals that do nothing but cause flora imbalance, even causing the tongue to bleed, is bad.

Not sure about the nose blowing. If you are getting a very obvious bad taste in your mouth out of nowhere when you blow your nose, you should get this checked out. There's quite a few things this could relate to.
If you could explain a bit more clearly what you mean about the bad taste.

When you are in a shower, your nose acclimatizes to the different odours, shampoos and showergels etc, and it then becomes much more sensitive to any bad odours which it may have become used to smelling under normal cirsumstances.

[danger]

Danger, I dont think rubbing your finger on your tongue will have any detrimental effect. When we eat we're scraping our tongues constantly. Lightly scraping the tongue is good, but its when you hear of people spending 30 minutes obsessively scraping and repeating and using chemicals that do nothing but cause flora imbalance, even causing the tongue to bleed, is bad.

Not sure about the nose blowing. If you are getting a very obvious bad taste in your mouth out of nowhere when you blow your nose, you should get this checked out. There's quite a few things this could relate to.
If you could explain a bit more clearly what you mean about the bad taste.

When you are in a shower, your nose acclimatizes to the different odours, shampoos and showergels etc, and it then becomes much more sensitive to any bad odours which it may have become used to smelling under normal cirsumstances.

a couple of days ago i lightly scraped my tongue with a teaspoon and for the next few hours the taste in my mouth seemed worse

i am not sure how to explain the taste when i blow my nose. it does not happen every time i blow my nose. i think it happens when my mouth is dry. maybe i wouldnt even notice if i was not so paranoid about every little taste in my mouth

edit: also, when my bottom right wisdom teeth was in i used to notice an odour from that area when i blew my nose for some reason. that maybe how i become paranoid with noticing tastes when i blow my nose

in the morning when i got up and used to brush my teeth etc, after that i used to blow my nose and always still notice a horrible taste every morning. if i brush my teeth now in the morning etc and then i blow my nose i hardly ever get any type of bad taste. that is why i am sure that wisdom tooth extraction has helped in some way