Sour breath

Tired1234 · Post by **Tired1234** » Tue Nov 10, 2015 1:03 am

Does anyone else have a strong sour smell when doing the lick test ?

If so, what do you do to get rid of it ?

Thank you.

I'm all out of ideas

Bear44 · Post by **Bear44** » Wed Nov 11, 2015 1:01 pm

Yeah I think mine is sour when I do the lick test. At first I thought my problem was bacterial but I'm starting to think reflux could be a major contributing factor.

- I had a fish oil supplement at dinner and did the lick test in the middle of the night and I smelled a subtle fish smell.

- The smell is only coming from my tongue, meaning it's probably either coming from my stomach or lingual tonsils.

- ENT said my lingual tonsils looked good, but he saw food in the back of my throat indicating reflux.

So now I need to find ways to treat reflux/weak lower esophageal sphincter and see if I have any improvements.

Any ideas?

Tired1234 · Post by **Tired1234** » Thu Nov 12, 2015 1:00 am

I'm not sure what it can be.. I know when I took cipro my bad breath was gone during. I know antibiotics is really bad though so I won't take it anymore..

Corpsebreath · Post by **Corpsebreath** » Thu Nov 12, 2015 4:02 am

Bear44 wrote:Yeah I think mine is sour when I do the lick test. At first I thought my problem was bacterial but I'm starting to think reflux could be a major contributing factor.

- I had a fish oil supplement at dinner and did the lick test in the middle of the night and I smelled a subtle fish smell.

- The smell is only coming from my tongue, meaning it's probably either coming from my stomach or lingual tonsils.

- ENT said my lingual tonsils looked good, but he saw food in the back of my throat indicating reflux.

So now I need to find ways to treat reflux/weak lower esophageal sphincter and see if I have any improvements.

Any ideas?

If you suspect reflux may be the culprit then just try ppi's for a while. If they make no difference whatsoever, then you know it has to be something else.

Bear44 · Post by **Bear44** » Thu Nov 12, 2015 7:48 am

Corpsebreath wrote: If you suspect reflux may be the culprit then just try ppi's for a while. If they make no difference whatsoever, then you know it has to be something else.

Well, as far as I'm aware ppi's just lower stomach acidity, they don't fix a defective lower esophageal sphincter and prevent reflux. Please correct me if I'm wrong. It seems like an issue with acid reflux is actually low stomach acid, so ppi's can treat the symptoms, but actually might make it worse and never cure it.

I've been reading up a lot on reflux and came across a fantastic pdf write up about it here:

http://my.chriskresser.com/wp-content/u ... 20GERD.pdf

I've also mentioned in previous posts that my bad breath went away while on my post-op antibiotic regime after tonsillectomy. This quote from the link I posted above may provide an answer as to why my bad breath went away (assuming it's from reflux).

On page 10:

"In a study by Pehl, administration of erythromycin (an antibiotic) significantly decreased esophageal reflux. In another study by Pennathur, erythromycin strengthened the defective lower esophageal sphincter in patients with acid reflux."

I don't recall which antibiotic I was on, but hearing that antibiotics can (at least temporarily) reduce/eliminate acid reflux may explain why my symptoms went away for that period of time. The antibiotic may have influenced LES activity and also a bacterial overgrowth. The link above discusses high carb intake with bacterial overgrowth and excess gas production which contributes to reflux...

Currently experimenting with HCL, digestive enzymes, and a low carbohydrate diet as indicated in the link above.

Corpsebreath · Post by **Corpsebreath** » Thu Nov 12, 2015 3:05 pm

Bear44 wrote:
Corpsebreath wrote: If you suspect reflux may be the culprit then just try ppi's for a while. If they make no difference whatsoever, then you know it has to be something else.
Well, as far as I'm aware ppi's just lower stomach acidity, they don't fix a defective lower esophageal sphincter and prevent reflux. Please correct me if I'm wrong. It seems like an issue with acid reflux is actually low stomach acid, so ppi's can treat the symptoms, but actually might make it worse and never cure it.

I've been reading up a lot on reflux and came across a fantastic pdf write up about it here:

http://my.chriskresser.com/wp-content/u ... 20GERD.pdf

I've also mentioned in previous posts that my bad breath went away while on my post-op antibiotic regime after tonsillectomy. This quote from the link I posted above may provide an answer as to why my bad breath went away (assuming it's from reflux).

On page 10:

"In a study by Pehl, administration of erythromycin (an antibiotic) significantly decreased esophageal reflux. In another study by Pennathur, erythromycin strengthened the defective lower esophageal sphincter in patients with acid reflux."

I don't recall which antibiotic I was on, but hearing that antibiotics can (at least temporarily) reduce/eliminate acid reflux may explain why my symptoms went away for that period of time. The antibiotic may have influenced LES activity and also a bacterial overgrowth. The link above discusses high carb intake with bacterial overgrowth and excess gas production which contributes to reflux...

Currently experimenting with HCL, digestive enzymes, and a low carbohydrate diet as indicated in the link above.

I would take that pdf file with a grain of salt. That guy works with Functional Medicine, which is the name of a type of alternative medicine.
Reflux being caused by too little acid is not something that has been proven.

But if what you say is true, that antibiotics can reduce reflux and improve acid reflux symptoms. Then perhaps both your acid reflux and your bb are symptoms of bacterial overgrowth. Instead of one causing the other?

Bear44 · Post by **Bear44** » Thu Nov 12, 2015 11:52 pm

Corpsebreath wrote:
Bear44 wrote:
Corpsebreath wrote: If you suspect reflux may be the culprit then just try ppi's for a while. If they make no difference whatsoever, then you know it has to be something else.
Well, as far as I'm aware ppi's just lower stomach acidity, they don't fix a defective lower esophageal sphincter and prevent reflux. Please correct me if I'm wrong. It seems like an issue with acid reflux is actually low stomach acid, so ppi's can treat the symptoms, but actually might make it worse and never cure it.

I've been reading up a lot on reflux and came across a fantastic pdf write up about it here:

http://my.chriskresser.com/wp-content/u ... 20GERD.pdf

I've also mentioned in previous posts that my bad breath went away while on my post-op antibiotic regime after tonsillectomy. This quote from the link I posted above may provide an answer as to why my bad breath went away (assuming it's from reflux).

On page 10:

"In a study by Pehl, administration of erythromycin (an antibiotic) significantly decreased esophageal reflux. In another study by Pennathur, erythromycin strengthened the defective lower esophageal sphincter in patients with acid reflux."

I don't recall which antibiotic I was on, but hearing that antibiotics can (at least temporarily) reduce/eliminate acid reflux may explain why my symptoms went away for that period of time. The antibiotic may have influenced LES activity and also a bacterial overgrowth. The link above discusses high carb intake with bacterial overgrowth and excess gas production which contributes to reflux...

Currently experimenting with HCL, digestive enzymes, and a low carbohydrate diet as indicated in the link above.
I would take that pdf file with a grain of salt. That guy works with Functional Medicine, which is the name of a type of alternative medicine.
Reflux being caused by too little acid is not something that has been proven.

But if what you say is true, that antibiotics can reduce reflux and improve acid reflux symptoms. Then perhaps both your acid reflux and your bb are symptoms of bacterial overgrowth. Instead of one causing the other?

You could be right...I'm getting surgery in early December to fix deviated septum and remove a polyp/cyst they found in my sinus via ct scan. I'm sure they'll put me on antibiotics again and we'll see if anything happens...

Corpsebreath · Post by **Corpsebreath** » Fri Nov 13, 2015 2:10 am

Bear44 wrote:You could be right...I'm getting surgery in early December to fix deviated septum and remove a polyp/cyst they found in my sinus via ct scan. I'm sure they'll put me on antibiotics again and we'll see if anything happens...

Do you happen to know in which sinus the polyp/cyst is located? Is it in the maxillary sinus? I have a polypoid swelling thing going on in there, and on my ct scan you can also see a hardening underneath it. I pleaded to them to remove it, but they refused...

Tired1234 · Post by **Tired1234** » Tue Nov 17, 2015 4:13 am

My lick test is less sour now. It's either because I stopped eating red meat and pork or because I started taking digestive enzymes !!!

Bear44 · Post by **Bear44** » Tue Nov 17, 2015 8:20 am

I don't really know where the polyp is, I'm sorry :\ I'll ask during my pre-op appointment at the end of the month.

Tired1234, I also started taking HCL with Pepsin and digestive enzymes while eating very low carbohydrate diet for the past 3 days and noticed a small improvement in my breath. Try eating very low carbohydrate if you can and see if it has any effect.

If you google carbohydrates and acid reflux there seems to be a connection. It may be due to poor carbohydrate digestion. Make sure to chew your food a lot before swallowing. There are enzymes in your saliva that help breakdown food but get de-activated by stomach acid once you swallow it.

I'm basically just eating protein and lots of vegetables (non-starchy ones). No added sugars, my daily carbs are really low and it's not that fun to eat like this, but we'll see after a week or two if any more changes happen.

Atrial · Post by **Atrial** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 12:19 am

Bear44 wrote:I don't really know where the polyp is, I'm sorry :\ I'll ask during my pre-op appointment at the end of the month.

Tired1234, I also started taking HCL with Pepsin and digestive enzymes while eating very low carbohydrate diet for the past 3 days and noticed a small improvement in my breath. Try eating very low carbohydrate if you can and see if it has any effect.

If you google carbohydrates and acid reflux there seems to be a connection. It may be due to poor carbohydrate digestion. Make sure to chew your food a lot before swallowing. There are enzymes in your saliva that help breakdown food but get de-activated by stomach acid once you swallow it.

I'm basically just eating protein and lots of vegetables (non-starchy ones). No added sugars, my daily carbs are really low and it's not that fun to eat like this, but we'll see after a week or two if any more changes happen.

you're only eating protein based on some reasons that you made up.
Your bb will be 10 x worse. If you want to find out keep the diet for 1 more week and take a public transport and see what happens.