Hello All,
I am now in my fifties and have been dealing with a bb problem since my teenage years. My oral habits have been fairly good and I have a healthy appearance in my teeth and gums; however, nothing provided a satisfactory result to eliminate my bb. I’ve tried many of the methods in the market place and none provided long-lasting relief. It seems that the causes of bb are varied and complex and finding the one-size-fits-all solution has not been easy. Each person will have to experiment to find the unique solution for them. I emphasize that this is an on-going search of mine.
Here’s is the approach that is working for me.
1. Brush twice daily. I use a Sonicare that provides an automatic, two-minute cycle. I use Crest Tartar Control.
2. Floss daily before bedtime.
3. Gently brush your tongue. I use the Tung Brush commonly sold in markets and pharmacies.
If my routine ended here, I would achieve healthy teeth and gums but still have bb.
4. Chew one (1), don’t swallow it whole, Pepto-Bismol tablet in the morning and at night. The bismuth sub-salicylate, Pepto Bismol’s active ingredient, binds to free sulfur in the system, which limits, to some degree, the free sulfur in one’s system. Note: if one chews a Pepto Bismol tablet before bed, their tongue will be black in color by morning as the bismuth sub-salicylate is converted to bismuth sulfide (black) given off by the bacteria overnight. The black color may be easily brushed off the tongue and rinsed away.
For me Step 4 is essential; however, if my routine ended here, I would achieve healthy teeth and gums, and would have further reduced, but still not fully eliminated bb. I caution the readers that I am not a physician and cannot testify to the safety, or danger, of long-term use of Pepto-Bismol at this rate.
5. Reduce your protein intake to limit the unused sulfur in your diet. The recommended daily protein requirement for an adult is approximately 4 ounces of lean meat, poultry, fish, or eggs. On average, your body does not use or store protein beyond this amount, unless you are building new muscle mass, and therefore the body eliminates it in several ways. The majority exits your body as solid waste; however, a fraction is soluble protein in saliva that oral bacterial vigorously convert into volatile sulfur compounds producing bb. Daily intake of fruit and yogurt have helped.
6. On occasion I substitute the toothpaste, in Step 1, with a dry-mixture of ordinary salt and ground black pepper in equal parts. It is an unpleasant sensation to use this, but it is somewhat effective, I believe due to the fact that both salt and pepper are antimicrobial; and together they have both a water solubility (salt) and an oil/fat solubility (pepper) that globally affects the offending bacterial membrane that water-soluble toothpastes alone cannot fully reach. I gently brush my tongue with the mixture as well focusing toward the back. Then rinse with water. As I said, unpleasant, but somewhat effective.
I realize that traditional, over-the-counter remedies, do not work as advertised. I continue to experiment and look for improvement.
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Some additional steps to traditional oral hygiene routine
Where have you been all this time 
? Good advice!
The protein intake is a problem for people like us ... do you think it would be enough to just eat protein pills and thereby at least bypassing the direct contact between the protein and the oral anaerobic bacteria?
Do you know anyplace online where I can order Pepto-Bismol overseas? Where did you get the info regarding it's sulphur-binding quality? Sounds like a superb thing to try...
I've been thinking of cutting sulphur-containing foods completely, in order to get rid of the ever-present fecal stench, but maybe that's impossible... Anyway, here's a list of sulphur levels in various foods:
>Link<
Edit: according to that list, Pepper is actually quite high in sulphur... so it's odd that brushing the tongue with salt+pepper is helping your bb... confusing! I will try it anyway...
? Good advice!The protein intake is a problem for people like us ... do you think it would be enough to just eat protein pills and thereby at least bypassing the direct contact between the protein and the oral anaerobic bacteria?
Do you know anyplace online where I can order Pepto-Bismol overseas? Where did you get the info regarding it's sulphur-binding quality? Sounds like a superb thing to try...
I've been thinking of cutting sulphur-containing foods completely, in order to get rid of the ever-present fecal stench, but maybe that's impossible... Anyway, here's a list of sulphur levels in various foods:
>Link<
Edit: according to that list, Pepper is actually quite high in sulphur... so it's odd that brushing the tongue with salt+pepper is helping your bb... confusing! I will try it anyway...
Hello Larc400,
Bismuth sub-salicylate is sold in the USA, and I imagine in Europe as well, by the brand name Pepto-Bismol. It is the bright, pink-colored, over-the-counter medicine sold for upset stomachs. Practitioners believe it suppresses the growth of H. pylori. It also binds to free sulfur. It comes in three forms, i.e, chewable tablets (which I use), liquid, or caplets. It is inexpensive and I have been using it for at least three years, at the rate of one chewable tablet, twice daily. I use it to absorb excess sulfur within my system to limit volatile sulfur compounds from forming. Bismuth sub-salicylate binds with sulfur to form bismuth-sulfide, a black (in color) odorless compound that is expelled in one's solid waste, i.e. the bismuth binds sulfur in the solid-state limiting its ability to vaporize as unpleasant hydrogen sulfide gas. You will literally see the proof of this binding action by (forgive me) darkened stool upon elimination. The darkening is due to the formation of bismuth sulfide in your digestive system that then leaves your system each day. This is a good result. It is evidence of the free sulfur that was denied entrance to ones mouth carried through the saliva, i.e. denying the oral bacteria the sulfur since it is tied up in your digestive tract until it is evacuated from your system.
Per your next question, I do not believe it is necessary to bypass the mouth when eating protein, i.e, by encapsulating protein and swallowing. Rather, I think it is important to limit the daily protein intake keeping it at, or below, 4 ounces in 24 hours. Consistent with this view is the fact that people on the Atkins diet, i.e. eating mostly protein and very few carbs to reduce body weight, suffer chronic bb in exchange for a trim waistline. This is due to the fact that the body uses the protein for energy keeping the dieters feeling energetic; however, the body has nowhere to store the extra protein after digestion takes place and the muscle-mass is built. So a portion of the sulfur in the excess protein exits the body in many aromatic ways. This is especially true for other carnivores that primarily eat protein such as cats and dogs, i.e. unpleasant smelling waste products.
The pepper I occasionally use, as a toothpaste substitute, brings very little sulfur into my system, and moreover, I rinse it out, rather than ingest it, after the tooth brushing, so the contribution to the total input is close to zero.
Bismuth sub-salicylate is sold in the USA, and I imagine in Europe as well, by the brand name Pepto-Bismol. It is the bright, pink-colored, over-the-counter medicine sold for upset stomachs. Practitioners believe it suppresses the growth of H. pylori. It also binds to free sulfur. It comes in three forms, i.e, chewable tablets (which I use), liquid, or caplets. It is inexpensive and I have been using it for at least three years, at the rate of one chewable tablet, twice daily. I use it to absorb excess sulfur within my system to limit volatile sulfur compounds from forming. Bismuth sub-salicylate binds with sulfur to form bismuth-sulfide, a black (in color) odorless compound that is expelled in one's solid waste, i.e. the bismuth binds sulfur in the solid-state limiting its ability to vaporize as unpleasant hydrogen sulfide gas. You will literally see the proof of this binding action by (forgive me) darkened stool upon elimination. The darkening is due to the formation of bismuth sulfide in your digestive system that then leaves your system each day. This is a good result. It is evidence of the free sulfur that was denied entrance to ones mouth carried through the saliva, i.e. denying the oral bacteria the sulfur since it is tied up in your digestive tract until it is evacuated from your system.
Per your next question, I do not believe it is necessary to bypass the mouth when eating protein, i.e, by encapsulating protein and swallowing. Rather, I think it is important to limit the daily protein intake keeping it at, or below, 4 ounces in 24 hours. Consistent with this view is the fact that people on the Atkins diet, i.e. eating mostly protein and very few carbs to reduce body weight, suffer chronic bb in exchange for a trim waistline. This is due to the fact that the body uses the protein for energy keeping the dieters feeling energetic; however, the body has nowhere to store the extra protein after digestion takes place and the muscle-mass is built. So a portion of the sulfur in the excess protein exits the body in many aromatic ways. This is especially true for other carnivores that primarily eat protein such as cats and dogs, i.e. unpleasant smelling waste products.
The pepper I occasionally use, as a toothpaste substitute, brings very little sulfur into my system, and moreover, I rinse it out, rather than ingest it, after the tooth brushing, so the contribution to the total input is close to zero.
Bloorain,
I first discovered that I could do something for my bb when I stumbled on the Finklestein test, wherein one finger massages the back of the throat (tonsils if one has them) and offensive tonsil stones are dislodged and removed. When this happened my bb dramatically improved for a short period, perhaps several hours, then it steadily returned.
I started experimenting with many products aimed at eliminating bb. None immediately worked to my satisfaction until, for me, I stumbled on the connection of bb and my food choices. The bb effects of onions and garlic were instant and therefore obvious. However, the bb effects of other foods, particularly excessive animal protein, were not readily apparent and went overlooked.
When I stay on my routine the bb ranges from very low, i.e. essentially gone, up to mild bb. For me, the one tablet of chewable Pepto-Bismol twice-daily seems essential. I manage, in this manner, following the routine outlined in my first posting, i.e. morning and night Sonicare brushing with Crest containing baking soda and peroxide, or Tarter Control), flossing, and gentle tongue brushing with the Tung brush.
I occasionally use a Water Pik to jet water between all teeth and gums until the water runs clear, i.e. not clouded, to flush out all bacteria that brushing alone cannot reach. I have also taken one of the extra plastic Water Pik ends and cut off the jet tip to allow the pumped water to exit slower than intended. I use this device to occasionally irrigate the back of my throat and tonsils. As my oral health began to improve, my need to Water Pik has dramatically declined.
Note: I can cause bb to rapidly bloom to intensive levels if I binge on excessive meat protein in a single meal or sequential meals. The bb will decrease, within a day, as my diet returns to a balanced array of food, minimal in animal protein.
The low level of occasional bb I now have may be due to PND and low-level of bacteria in tonsil crypts. I may, one day, opt for Laser Tonsil Ablation. But for now, my routine seems to be working okay.
I first discovered that I could do something for my bb when I stumbled on the Finklestein test, wherein one finger massages the back of the throat (tonsils if one has them) and offensive tonsil stones are dislodged and removed. When this happened my bb dramatically improved for a short period, perhaps several hours, then it steadily returned.
I started experimenting with many products aimed at eliminating bb. None immediately worked to my satisfaction until, for me, I stumbled on the connection of bb and my food choices. The bb effects of onions and garlic were instant and therefore obvious. However, the bb effects of other foods, particularly excessive animal protein, were not readily apparent and went overlooked.
When I stay on my routine the bb ranges from very low, i.e. essentially gone, up to mild bb. For me, the one tablet of chewable Pepto-Bismol twice-daily seems essential. I manage, in this manner, following the routine outlined in my first posting, i.e. morning and night Sonicare brushing with Crest containing baking soda and peroxide, or Tarter Control), flossing, and gentle tongue brushing with the Tung brush.
I occasionally use a Water Pik to jet water between all teeth and gums until the water runs clear, i.e. not clouded, to flush out all bacteria that brushing alone cannot reach. I have also taken one of the extra plastic Water Pik ends and cut off the jet tip to allow the pumped water to exit slower than intended. I use this device to occasionally irrigate the back of my throat and tonsils. As my oral health began to improve, my need to Water Pik has dramatically declined.
Note: I can cause bb to rapidly bloom to intensive levels if I binge on excessive meat protein in a single meal or sequential meals. The bb will decrease, within a day, as my diet returns to a balanced array of food, minimal in animal protein.
The low level of occasional bb I now have may be due to PND and low-level of bacteria in tonsil crypts. I may, one day, opt for Laser Tonsil Ablation. But for now, my routine seems to be working okay.
Larc400
I spent years confused regarding products, theories, and claims about solving bb. These products are aimed at killing the bacteria. Instead we should starve them. Making a dietary change, simple as it sounds, is challenging to do, but it can be done, and for me it works. I encourage anyone interested to do a test, by purifying their diet, which may take a few days to produce a convincing result. When you notice that it works, you will then have the answer and you will be in control.
I have a theory, which for me, is working. It assumes that the person with bb is otherwise healthy. Here it is:
BB results from two necessary things.
1. A food source, i.e. nutrient-rich saliva, with the potential to become foul-smelling when it comes in contact with certain bacteria that convert this food source to offensive-smelling gases.
2. Certain species of bacteria growing in the mouths of people.
If we get rid of either single item in the list above, we eliminate bb, i.e. we either starve the bacteria by denying them those foods with potential to “spoil’ in ones mouth, or, we kill all of the offending bacterial while keeping the food source present.
I have found that, for the long-term, it is easier to keep the offensive bacteria population low by starving them, versus the need to kill them, several times daily, with poison/chemicals.
I am becoming convinced that those of us with bb can best manage the condition by altering our diet, i.e. limiting certain food intake, rather than killing the offensive bacteria. Said another way: create saliva with low-levels of material that can “spoil”.
Here’s why:
I have read that many of us, myself included, have tried poisoning, thus temporarily killing, the bacteria by using mild or harsh chemicals to accomplish the goal, i.e. mouthwash or antibacterial soaps (quaternary ammonium salts, phenols, chlorinedioxide, etc), or by taking antibiotics. This, sometimes, gives temporary relief, but it may be a lost war because the climate in our mouths is friendly to the offending bacteria as the poison eventually rinses away while we continue to feed the few remaining bacteria with nutrient-rich saliva. These few remaining bacteria rapidly reproduce and repopulate our mouths, sometimes within minutes or hours. This is why we are burning our tongues with corrosive chemicals, or over-brushing our teeth and tongues without achieving a clean-smelling result.
I think the solution is to forever-starve the offensive bacteria by continuously producing nutrient-lean saliva, i.e. we each should eat just the foods and just a certain amount of each type of food that our bodies can use, with little excess left over. If we do this the oral population of organisms will rebalance and our noses and taste can tell us when we each, individually, get it right.
We all need animal protein; however, I believe many with bb are eating too much each day, thus feeding the offensive oral bacteria with nutrient-rich saliva. Therefore I believe we can control it by adjusting what, and how much, we eat. It differs for each individual. This is my theory. I welcome your comments.
I spent years confused regarding products, theories, and claims about solving bb. These products are aimed at killing the bacteria. Instead we should starve them. Making a dietary change, simple as it sounds, is challenging to do, but it can be done, and for me it works. I encourage anyone interested to do a test, by purifying their diet, which may take a few days to produce a convincing result. When you notice that it works, you will then have the answer and you will be in control.
I have a theory, which for me, is working. It assumes that the person with bb is otherwise healthy. Here it is:
BB results from two necessary things.
1. A food source, i.e. nutrient-rich saliva, with the potential to become foul-smelling when it comes in contact with certain bacteria that convert this food source to offensive-smelling gases.
2. Certain species of bacteria growing in the mouths of people.
If we get rid of either single item in the list above, we eliminate bb, i.e. we either starve the bacteria by denying them those foods with potential to “spoil’ in ones mouth, or, we kill all of the offending bacterial while keeping the food source present.
I have found that, for the long-term, it is easier to keep the offensive bacteria population low by starving them, versus the need to kill them, several times daily, with poison/chemicals.
I am becoming convinced that those of us with bb can best manage the condition by altering our diet, i.e. limiting certain food intake, rather than killing the offensive bacteria. Said another way: create saliva with low-levels of material that can “spoil”.
Here’s why:
I have read that many of us, myself included, have tried poisoning, thus temporarily killing, the bacteria by using mild or harsh chemicals to accomplish the goal, i.e. mouthwash or antibacterial soaps (quaternary ammonium salts, phenols, chlorinedioxide, etc), or by taking antibiotics. This, sometimes, gives temporary relief, but it may be a lost war because the climate in our mouths is friendly to the offending bacteria as the poison eventually rinses away while we continue to feed the few remaining bacteria with nutrient-rich saliva. These few remaining bacteria rapidly reproduce and repopulate our mouths, sometimes within minutes or hours. This is why we are burning our tongues with corrosive chemicals, or over-brushing our teeth and tongues without achieving a clean-smelling result.
I think the solution is to forever-starve the offensive bacteria by continuously producing nutrient-lean saliva, i.e. we each should eat just the foods and just a certain amount of each type of food that our bodies can use, with little excess left over. If we do this the oral population of organisms will rebalance and our noses and taste can tell us when we each, individually, get it right.
We all need animal protein; however, I believe many with bb are eating too much each day, thus feeding the offensive oral bacteria with nutrient-rich saliva. Therefore I believe we can control it by adjusting what, and how much, we eat. It differs for each individual. This is my theory. I welcome your comments.
tried the pepto bismal tablet last night
i rinsed out my mouth with a non alcohol moutwash afterward though, because it had been so long since i had done so (i think the tonsil sotne smell was getting all throughout my mouth.. i could smell it in backdraft, hoping it wasn't me.. ugh i hate that smell)
when i woke up this morning, i could smell a lot of the shitty smell (different from the tonsil stone smell).. i think it's because it's already embedded into my bed sheets and pillows.. and maybe i was passing gas in my sleep :p (recently i've noticed my gas has a way too similar, yet stronger smell than what seems to be in the air coming out of mouth/nose.. my bowels are almost always a little irritated or active too.. like a minor upset stomach ache all the time or as if i'm having minor diaharea effects but all the time)
anyway, there was some blackstuff on my tongue, as searching had said there would be.. And the next part could just be a fluke, cause not everyday is bad, but I don't really smell the shitty smell coming out of my nose very much.. Usually I can smell it pretty well in the morning when i put my hand near my face, blow my nose, or wash my face close to the sink.. It needs something to bounce off of shortly.
I think searching's theory of extra sulfur may be true for me with the constant upset stomach feeling and the same smell everytime i excrete wastes.. It seems like there's such a potent amount of this smell in my body that it starts getting into other parts of my body somehow... I'm still not sure if it's coming out of just my nose, or both my nose and mouth.. During summer when i was biking a lot, i could have sworn i could smell it in my shirts on the chest and back/shoulders area (many pores there) but then again it could have also just been in my nose while trying to smell it. I'm fairly certain though that it was coming out of those pores.. like my body has an overload of this stuff..
i rinsed out my mouth with a non alcohol moutwash afterward though, because it had been so long since i had done so (i think the tonsil sotne smell was getting all throughout my mouth.. i could smell it in backdraft, hoping it wasn't me.. ugh i hate that smell)
when i woke up this morning, i could smell a lot of the shitty smell (different from the tonsil stone smell).. i think it's because it's already embedded into my bed sheets and pillows.. and maybe i was passing gas in my sleep :p (recently i've noticed my gas has a way too similar, yet stronger smell than what seems to be in the air coming out of mouth/nose.. my bowels are almost always a little irritated or active too.. like a minor upset stomach ache all the time or as if i'm having minor diaharea effects but all the time)
anyway, there was some blackstuff on my tongue, as searching had said there would be.. And the next part could just be a fluke, cause not everyday is bad, but I don't really smell the shitty smell coming out of my nose very much.. Usually I can smell it pretty well in the morning when i put my hand near my face, blow my nose, or wash my face close to the sink.. It needs something to bounce off of shortly.
I think searching's theory of extra sulfur may be true for me with the constant upset stomach feeling and the same smell everytime i excrete wastes.. It seems like there's such a potent amount of this smell in my body that it starts getting into other parts of my body somehow... I'm still not sure if it's coming out of just my nose, or both my nose and mouth.. During summer when i was biking a lot, i could have sworn i could smell it in my shirts on the chest and back/shoulders area (many pores there) but then again it could have also just been in my nose while trying to smell it. I'm fairly certain though that it was coming out of those pores.. like my body has an overload of this stuff..
Hi Searching,
yes, it's a good tactic: trying to starve the bacteria instead of killing them with 'poison'. I'd be more than happy to change my diet radically as long as I don't lose weight or cause harm by malnutrition. I'm already B12 deficient so gotta take care
I have a couple of queries which I hope you can clarify:
1. When limiting protein intake: is it enough to limit the actual protein which come in direct contact with the tongue / oral cavity? Is it okay to eat protein pills instead, as they don't come in direct contact with these bacteria? Or do all proteins we ingest eventually reach these bacteria via other systems..?
2. If possible, please give examples of your protein intake or general diet... do you lose weight with this regime..?
I also had an old idea of trying to alter the pH of the oral cavity, as the offending bacteria don't thrive in an acidic environment. Sadly an acidic oral cavity is no good for teeth though... anyway, something to consider.
yes, it's a good tactic: trying to starve the bacteria instead of killing them with 'poison'. I'd be more than happy to change my diet radically as long as I don't lose weight or cause harm by malnutrition. I'm already B12 deficient so gotta take care
I have a couple of queries which I hope you can clarify:
1. When limiting protein intake: is it enough to limit the actual protein which come in direct contact with the tongue / oral cavity? Is it okay to eat protein pills instead, as they don't come in direct contact with these bacteria? Or do all proteins we ingest eventually reach these bacteria via other systems..?
2. If possible, please give examples of your protein intake or general diet... do you lose weight with this regime..?
I also had an old idea of trying to alter the pH of the oral cavity, as the offending bacteria don't thrive in an acidic environment. Sadly an acidic oral cavity is no good for teeth though... anyway, something to consider.
Larc400
In reply to your questions:
I believe that once an excess of protein enters your system, chewed or swallow whole, your body now has to deal with it, and the excess may cause bb. I don't think the solution is to minimize the mouth’s exposure to protein while eating.
I believe the key is to limit the total daily protein, rather than the method of ingestion. I think the body’s nutritional need for protein is like a protein sponge. Each day it requires a small, fixed amount. Any extra will saturate the body and the overflow “spoils” in the body. If we limit the protein, which I see as the solution to some forms of bb, the body will out-compete the guest bacteria and they will starve thus decreasing their population and offensive by-products.
All of the protein I eat comes in full oral contact, i.e. I chew a hamburger, chicken, eggs, etc. No problem if I keep below an excessive amount of protein per meal or per day. If, however, I somehow ate excess protein while limiting its contact with my tongue, teeth, etc., I think bb would indeed still be a problem, due to the fact that the protein eaten would saturate my system and have nowhere to be stored. It would normally digest in my system, enter the bloodstream to nourish my cells; however, an excess would still be present thus saturating my system with nowhere to store it. Most would be eliminated in the bathroom; however, a fraction would exit via perspiration and saliva. The offensive oral bacteria are there as janitors in our mouths to breakdown materials to help the body rid us of the material. Unfortunately some of these decomposed products, liberated in the food decomposition, smell bad due to the sulfur building blocks present in the eaten animal protein.
Please read, for example, a yogurt package, or a meat package. It indicates the daily protein intake required is just 50 grams. Most of us will find that daily protein requirement surprisingly small, and therein lies the problem. Our diets are far too heavily tilted toward excessive protein intake. The proper intake is, for example, only ½ of a ¼ lb. hamburger daily. Over the course of a day many of us eat up to 5 or 10 times that amount of protein in the form of eggs, cheese, milk, meat, poultry, etc. That is a large amount of extra protein for the body to discharge, and the decomposition products smell sour.
Each day I try to limit my animal protein to 4 ounces. That is just one 4 ounce hamburger, or a chicken breast, or portion of fish. I often fail to keep my intake that low; however, I clearly see the connection between excessive animal protein intake and bb. When I follow my proper routine I get the rest of my calories from fruits and vegetables, bread, cereal and pasta, and starch such as potatoes, rice, corn, etc.
I’m 5’10” and weigh about 170 lbs. I am not having problem keeping my weight controlled.
Here is one more confession. In the past, before I had my bb under control, good oral hygiene gave me healthy teeth and gums; however, I still had bb. So there were many occasions where I didn’t brush or floss thoroughly because I thought “what’s the use, I can’t get a good result”.
I mention this for the following reason. If one experiments with decreasing animal protein in their diet to a very low level, please continue to exercise good, normal oral hygiene habits so that you will notice the bb improvement when it happens.
Perhaps try this experiment, strictly for 1 solid week. Eat none, or some, albeit very limited animal protein, i.e. less than 4 ounces daily. Eat fruit, yogurt, pasta, bread, vegetables, French fries, cake, pie, cookies, etc. Twice daily brush, floss, gently use Tung brush. Optionally try one Pepto Bismol chewable tablet, twice daily. See what happens.
In reply to your questions:
I believe that once an excess of protein enters your system, chewed or swallow whole, your body now has to deal with it, and the excess may cause bb. I don't think the solution is to minimize the mouth’s exposure to protein while eating.
I believe the key is to limit the total daily protein, rather than the method of ingestion. I think the body’s nutritional need for protein is like a protein sponge. Each day it requires a small, fixed amount. Any extra will saturate the body and the overflow “spoils” in the body. If we limit the protein, which I see as the solution to some forms of bb, the body will out-compete the guest bacteria and they will starve thus decreasing their population and offensive by-products.
All of the protein I eat comes in full oral contact, i.e. I chew a hamburger, chicken, eggs, etc. No problem if I keep below an excessive amount of protein per meal or per day. If, however, I somehow ate excess protein while limiting its contact with my tongue, teeth, etc., I think bb would indeed still be a problem, due to the fact that the protein eaten would saturate my system and have nowhere to be stored. It would normally digest in my system, enter the bloodstream to nourish my cells; however, an excess would still be present thus saturating my system with nowhere to store it. Most would be eliminated in the bathroom; however, a fraction would exit via perspiration and saliva. The offensive oral bacteria are there as janitors in our mouths to breakdown materials to help the body rid us of the material. Unfortunately some of these decomposed products, liberated in the food decomposition, smell bad due to the sulfur building blocks present in the eaten animal protein.
Please read, for example, a yogurt package, or a meat package. It indicates the daily protein intake required is just 50 grams. Most of us will find that daily protein requirement surprisingly small, and therein lies the problem. Our diets are far too heavily tilted toward excessive protein intake. The proper intake is, for example, only ½ of a ¼ lb. hamburger daily. Over the course of a day many of us eat up to 5 or 10 times that amount of protein in the form of eggs, cheese, milk, meat, poultry, etc. That is a large amount of extra protein for the body to discharge, and the decomposition products smell sour.
Each day I try to limit my animal protein to 4 ounces. That is just one 4 ounce hamburger, or a chicken breast, or portion of fish. I often fail to keep my intake that low; however, I clearly see the connection between excessive animal protein intake and bb. When I follow my proper routine I get the rest of my calories from fruits and vegetables, bread, cereal and pasta, and starch such as potatoes, rice, corn, etc.
I’m 5’10” and weigh about 170 lbs. I am not having problem keeping my weight controlled.
Here is one more confession. In the past, before I had my bb under control, good oral hygiene gave me healthy teeth and gums; however, I still had bb. So there were many occasions where I didn’t brush or floss thoroughly because I thought “what’s the use, I can’t get a good result”.
I mention this for the following reason. If one experiments with decreasing animal protein in their diet to a very low level, please continue to exercise good, normal oral hygiene habits so that you will notice the bb improvement when it happens.
Perhaps try this experiment, strictly for 1 solid week. Eat none, or some, albeit very limited animal protein, i.e. less than 4 ounces daily. Eat fruit, yogurt, pasta, bread, vegetables, French fries, cake, pie, cookies, etc. Twice daily brush, floss, gently use Tung brush. Optionally try one Pepto Bismol chewable tablet, twice daily. See what happens.
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As i said in another thread, i've been on a 100% fruits+veggies diet for the past 2 weeks, i started Nov.5, I keep a journal of everything i've eaten so far.searching wrote:
I mention this for the following reason. If one experiments with decreasing animal protein in their diet to a very low level
Like you, i suspect excess of proteins might be the cause of our bb, for the people who aren't afflicted with TMAU. This would explain why even on a very healthy diet, some of us still have bb: we eat too much protein. It's possible that our livers are more lazy/clogged up than other people and cannot deal with excess protein, thus we get bb.
Anyway, yesterday, i had a conversation with my neighboor and for the 1st time ever, she didn't rub her nose once, so it's a sign this diet is working to a certain extent, or her nose was stuffed that day?
I will do more tests this week by talking to cashiers etc and see if i get reactions. I normally get reactions at least 50% of the time.I was surprised to find out that the recommended daily protein intake is only 50g, that's almost nothing. Even on a fruit+veggies diet, you get roughly 20g a day. A piece of fruit actually contain .5 to 1g of protein. A lil more for veggies.
I will not go off this diet until i can rule out that excess of protein isn't the cause of my bb, even if it kills me.
Has anyone done a similar experiment before?Yesterday, I had a long chat with a dietician about the same subject. Protein came up a lot in the discussion. I was raised as a meat and potatoes kind of guy. Before my halitosis problem surfaced, eating 2 steaks at one meal was no problem. I'd eat a half a chicken easily. I'd eat too much in general at each sitting... and I'm a small guy. I've never weighed over 150 lbs @ 5'10.
Anyway, I've been watching the things I eat lately, and my new plan is to eat 6 small meals, instead of the normal breakfast, lunch, dinner routine. I've already narrowed down the protien sources to turkey and chicken, occasionally fish. Beef and pork for cheating only.
Oatmeal for morning, something like an Ensure, or sugarless meal replacement bar before lunch. Half sandwich for lunch, 2nd half later... Small dinner with very little protien if at all.
I'm also going to keep a journal of the foods I eat... or at least try to keep track of when I "cheat" and what foods I should not have ate. So far, I have found that I can not eat ice cream at all. Beer is also just as bad.. but I can keep that as a friday treat only
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A last thing that was brought up was ketosis. We should not completely cut too much out of our diet, or the BB will come thru the back door!
Anyway, I've been watching the things I eat lately, and my new plan is to eat 6 small meals, instead of the normal breakfast, lunch, dinner routine. I've already narrowed down the protien sources to turkey and chicken, occasionally fish. Beef and pork for cheating only.
Oatmeal for morning, something like an Ensure, or sugarless meal replacement bar before lunch. Half sandwich for lunch, 2nd half later... Small dinner with very little protien if at all.
I'm also going to keep a journal of the foods I eat... or at least try to keep track of when I "cheat" and what foods I should not have ate. So far, I have found that I can not eat ice cream at all. Beer is also just as bad.. but I can keep that as a friday treat only
. A last thing that was brought up was ketosis. We should not completely cut too much out of our diet, or the BB will come thru the back door!
Searching, I took the Pepto last night(well, the generic version available at Walmart since they were sold out of the Pepto) and my stomach was not happy. Some minor pain and a bit of gas as a result. Hopefully it's because I took two instead of one(though the package did say to take two). Anyways, my question to you is if taking the two tablets everyday long term is safe. I don't consume two much protein as it is so overconsumption is not an issue for me.
Hopeful,
I don't know the side effects of long-term, Pepto Bismol use. I take one tablet once or sometimes twice daily with no side effect. I've never noticed stomach distress or discomfort after taking this.
Recently, I have been performing saline nasal irrigation, with very good results. Even though I don't have bb coming through the nose, the daily, saline nasal irrigation removes any accumulated mucus, from the nose and sinuses, and effectively decreases the PND that naturally occurs throughout the day. I am becoming convinced the PND was feeding oral bacteria. Now I am flushing that material from my system thus denying the bacteria a food source that used to drain downward onto my throat and tongue and spoil orally beginning immediately after brushing my teeth.
There are sites on the Internet that illustrate the best way to perform the method. I'm doing Stage 1 & Stage 2 (most effective) "Neti Pot" technique using warm water with small amounts of added table salt and baking soda. Wow, great result. This has become a part of my morning routine. I was motivated to try it after reading that Oceanside and Noptical achieved good results from this method as well.
I don't know the side effects of long-term, Pepto Bismol use. I take one tablet once or sometimes twice daily with no side effect. I've never noticed stomach distress or discomfort after taking this.
Recently, I have been performing saline nasal irrigation, with very good results. Even though I don't have bb coming through the nose, the daily, saline nasal irrigation removes any accumulated mucus, from the nose and sinuses, and effectively decreases the PND that naturally occurs throughout the day. I am becoming convinced the PND was feeding oral bacteria. Now I am flushing that material from my system thus denying the bacteria a food source that used to drain downward onto my throat and tongue and spoil orally beginning immediately after brushing my teeth.
There are sites on the Internet that illustrate the best way to perform the method. I'm doing Stage 1 & Stage 2 (most effective) "Neti Pot" technique using warm water with small amounts of added table salt and baking soda. Wow, great result. This has become a part of my morning routine. I was motivated to try it after reading that Oceanside and Noptical achieved good results from this method as well.
