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Important - nose rubs however people I trust saying no
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thissux
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Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Posts: 164

PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 1:31 am    Post subject: Important - nose rubs however people I trust saying no Reply with quote

Hi all,

I have not been here for awhile. I was in treatment as I am a recovering alcoholic that replapsed. While in treatment, my main issue was halitosis or halitophobia. My therapist said she had never smelled anything on my breath, though occasional nose rubs. But better, the women in treatment with me told me over and over again that there is no smell. They would go so far as to put their nose right under, almost in my mouth while I talked and breathed and told me there was no smell, or just the smell of "normal" breath. On a scale for 0 to 10 I got mostly 0's and occassional a 1 with no offensive odor. One swore on the bible 2 times and she is the type to say it like it is, she was from jail. She even smelled my tongue and my air from my nostrils. She did this several times a day. She said normal, plane jane, girl next door breath and that she would tell me out of respect. Another woman said on her kids life that she had NEVER smelled bad breath on me. As did all of the other women. They did this every day for weeks. These are the kid of women that would tell you. I was in there for two months. If my breath was room filling foul, could they put their nose in my mouth and have me talk and breath as they inhaled through their nose if it was that bad? Room filling bad. They told me they could do that all day. One woman said it smelled like baby breath. She said afterlunch it might smell like chocolate milk or whatever food I ate. Or that it smelled like mint after brushing. I am home now and I saw three nose rubs in different places. I am not sure what to do. I may go back to my family doctor who said he smelled it before and see what he says. I am not drinking and taking prilosec.They told me I could speak to anyone, anywhere at anytime without embarrassment. If it was foul could someone breath in from thier nose in my mouth without gagging? I'm I getting better? Do peoples noses just itch? They have no reason to lie. Opinions please.Thank you all!
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DanielPine
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Joined: 19 Jun 2012
Posts: 151
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 1:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

you do know people rub their nose because it is itchy, to hide a dribbly nose, to push snot away lol bad breath isnt the only reason people rub their nose
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jess
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Joined: 21 Feb 2006
Posts: 414
Location: East Coast, USA

PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 4:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You don't have your location there on your profile, but I think the best thing to do is try to meet with people in this forum and see what feedback they give you. I've had the same thing happen to me many times: doctors, their assistant putting their nose right in front of my mouth and sniffing and saying that they smell no bb on me. I know for a fact that I have chronic bb; I'm not crazy. But for one reason or another people won't tell us we have bb once they know we worry about it. Why, I don't know...
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halitosisux
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 1:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thissux, what kind of BB do you believe you suffer from?

i.e. Type-1, type-2 etc.

I see you said one of your testers smelled your tongue directly and couldn't smell anything, but if you rub your finger towards the back of your tongue, does it smell? how badly? etc

What reasons make you believe you have BB? Maybe you have intermittent BB or you had BB at times in the past. I know I did way back in my childhood, and it had nothing to do with anything except for normal things like neglect of hygiene and perhaps decay or whatever. I had loads of amalgam fillings in my childhood.

I hate it when people mention nose rubs. Of course if a person has BB then people are gonna rub their noses if you get too close, but people are also gonna rub their noses hundreds of times a day for no reason whatsoever. There's a big difference between someone being near another person and giving them a whiff of stench and seeing the obvious grimmacing expressions and gestures of panic nose blocking. But if you're looking for nose rubs in relation to your breath then you WILL find them everywhere.
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deebo
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Joined: 14 May 2010
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Location: Portland

PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yep ,, to me nose rubs alone are a bullshit way to know anything .

With that said , asking people if you have bb is a sure way to get a "no" answer ,,regardless how blunt and "no reason to lie " a person is or how the smell is . I used to ask all the time and now have a rule to Never Ask . On this site ,its been said a million times that reactions of strangers can be the best way to gauge bb . Like Halisux says , nose rubs are not a viable reaction . I'm talking about people wincing , lurching back ,covering their mouth/nose . Obvious reaction . People spraying air fresheners ,opening doors /windows , fanning the air with their hands in your face , comments like "Dam ,yo breath Stinks! " etc .

There is actually a ton of weird social aspects about malodor that I hope to document in the future . Neither sufferers or non-sufferers understand why they follow these social rules of odor .
I think about how easy it might to be make some people with perfectly good breath paranoid for years by just acting like they smell bad a few times .

One thing that we should consider asking for the manufacture of a portable device to measure the bb VOCs .
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halitosisux
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

deebo wrote:
I think about how easy it might to be make some people with perfectly good breath paranoid for years by just acting like they smell bad a few times .


That's all it takes. Even just one comment, whether true or not, mistakenly or intentionally, to plant the seed of BB paranoia in a person's head.

I consider my brother and sister EVIL for doing the things they did to me, knowing damn well it was affecting me at the time and would likely go on affecting me forever. I wonder how many times they really did notice bad breath on me. I wonder how many people on here have only been told once or twice in their whole life, but that's all it takes.
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thissux
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 9:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I has been difficult in trying to see if what these women are saying is true. There were 11 of us in the women's unit for the rehab center, from all walks of life. My roommate was the 50 year old from Jail that pretty much told people right to their face what she thought. She is the one that gave me a ray of hope that I may not have chronic bb. She would talk right in my face, well into my personal boundaries for 20 minutes or more. She would have me blow directly into her nose with her nose not even 2 inches from my mouth and would have me do it repeatedly....let's say 5 times, exhale then her deep inhale and would inhale deeply from her nose. She did this with me daily, sometimes 20 times per day. She swore on the bible on two occassions (she is a God fearing Christian) that I had absolutely no odor coming from anywhere on my body including my mouth. She told me she'd kiss me if I really wanted her to, but I am a woman (not that it would be a big deal). Another woman there had bad breath and the girls are going to tell her about it. Like build up to it and ask her if she needs to borrow toothpaste, if not they WILL approach her and she is a person that suffers from depression. All of the women there would put their nose pretty much in my mouth and have me talk and said it was a 0 or even that it smelled either neutral or good, kind of sweet like baby breath or at other times (I have reflux) my roommate said it smelled a bit like orange juice but light and not bad. She said sometimes it smelled actually quite good and better than most people. I asked my roommate for the 100th time if she could be honest with me and she wrote this: Even though you and I are closer than her and another woman there, the truth is still the truth! Not something I say because I like you. I would tell you in spite of the fact that we are closer....RESPECT. Then she wrote that I had: Normall, everyday, Average, Run of the Mill, Plain Jane, Girl Next Door Breath!!! That I could talk to Anybody, Anywhere, Anytime, that it is tongue teasing kissable breath. These women from jail tell people their feet stink or that they need to shower but in a nice way.I kept asking my other roommate who is not from jail and she kept saying no, she finally said if she told me it did smell that she would be lying.Another woman from the jail, younger girl who I had asked so many times grabbed my shoulders in the hall and shook me and said "it does not sink!". A guy there said that he was sitting right accross from me and 100% not at all.
Now, I am back at home as of yesterday. I joined the fitness club because I am really into it. When the salesperson was going over things with me he rubbed his nose a few times in a row, but did not look discusted or back away.Later that day I was working out and got called to the front desk, the girl who told me rubbed her nose. She did not look put off. Does that really mean anything? I am planning to go back to my family doctor who told me I did have bad breath (when I was actively drinking heavily). Could alcoholic drinking cause bad halitosis - shit breath really? I believe he will be honest with me. Is scratching a persons side of their nose a detection of a bad odor or just an itch as opposed to a full on nose rub? Or does any ot that matter?
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deebo
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Joined: 14 May 2010
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 1:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

From what I gather from you posts ,I'd say you had an acute temporary case of BB . Not chronic ongoing bb. Which is your case might mean instead you may have ORS or halitophobia alone right now . I think someone the TMAU webinar asked about drinking alcohol as a cause . It can of course compromises the liver which can cause an inability to break down certain chemicals it otherwise can (maybe temporarily?) So , drinking as a BB cause is possible I'd say. Not to mention alcohol breath .

I think during your stay in alcohol rehab ,you asked enough people enough time to convince one of the reality of their breath at that time . We have all asked this question . Although there are only 2 answers , there are a host of reasons for either answer . But I still think your "no" is genuine .

One of the guys in our tmau Facebook group says his Shrink ran a test . He said his Doc handed out a paper to everyone in the waiting room ,asking each person something like "do you smell anything usual ? Yes[ ],No [ ] , check 1" . So when he came in to the Shrinks office ,he was told about the test that was just run . I personally don't think that Doc understands how odor affects us and those around us ,even though he had the best intentions and was likely telling the truth about the odor he couldn't smell .

Again , I really feel the best thing would be a personal ,portable VOC tester or one at a Docs office . This way neither the Doc or the sufferer could have second thoughts . This way sufferers would know for sure what foods ,supplements ..etc.. cause or help odor . You can obviously see that Not Knowing can be the worst part of this issue .

Bottom Line ThisSux : the women were telling you the truth . Nose rubs mean Nothing . Chronic Alcoholism could in my layman's opinion possible cause strong BB .

You are of course welcomed in this group ,although you might consider beginning to occupy your mind with something better .
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thissux
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 3:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Deebo - thank you so very much for your response, from the bottom of my heart. I have always liked reading your posts and they are pretty straight forward. After so many people telling me and time and time again how normal it was and even describing what my "normal" breath smelled like it helped. I am planning to see my family doctor to see what he says now about it. My mom was just telling me why bother when I have had so much positive feedback. She has had to go through all of my paranoia and anxiety with this and is worn out. If I do not have bad breath, which it sounds like I don't (I continue to hope and pray even now) then I am suffering one heck of a case of halitophobia that is going to have to be addressed using cognitive therapy with someone who specializes in phobias. This was told to me by one of my therapists in treatment. I have moments of elation and joy and then a few nose rubs can send me into a real panic. My therapist said phobias are one of the more treatable problems. I will pray again tonight before bed. Would you go see the doctor that said he did notice the breath when I was actively drinking? I do still have an odd taste in my mouth, kind of tart and a tongue coating. I have at least two friends with the same taste and they do not have any bad breath so I do not feel that guarantees bad breath. When I scrape my tongue it has a scent, but more of a regular breath "scent" that I have smelled when I put my nose in other peopls breath during these tests.Not unpleasant and kind of neutral. I want to get on with my life. When I talked to a guy about joinning the gym today he rubbed his nose a few times one after the other, but did notsit back or look discusted, just like an itch he had to scratch a few times. I went out to eat with my brothers new wife and she did not scratch or rub her nose for at least 25 minutes. If you look at Doctor OZ from Oprah online he says that all people, on average rub, pick or scratch their nose on average 5 times per hour. Point to ponder. Please pass this on. Thanks so very much Deebo, Halitosisux, DanielPine and Jess for responding. If I am okay I hope I can come back her at times to support others. Maybe heavy drinking is a major cause for reflux bad breath. My thoughts are with each and everyone one of you.Please keep me in your prayers. I will keep you posted. Things people can say to other people can really hurt as others have mentioned. Thanks for that last mesage Deebo, hugs to you friend Very Happy I am going to tape it to my mirror. I have hope and everyone here does. Pray
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deebo
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 6:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AWESOME Smile
that makes my day on many levels

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HigherThoughts
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 8:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yea I think you get bad breath when you drink. You might have some allergic reaction or your liver could be having trouble filtering the alcohol. So that is one more reason for you to stop drinking completely.

I am glad you don't have any bb anymore. I think you should see someone about your developed halitophobia. Nose rubs alone don't mean you have bb. You have to look at their entire behaviors.

Like for me, I have really bad room filling bad breath. It comes out of my nose and people can smell it from quite a distance away.

I don't just see nose rubs when I talk to people. I see their entire behavior. Since the odor is so strong most of the customers I talk to act very awkward when they meet me. Also they literally have to turn their heads away. They don't look at my face as they talk to me and constantly look around or just move their heads away. Also people get looks of disgust or put a frown.

So I see an entire array of behaviors and not just nose rubs. Probably the next step you should take is seeing a therapist or something because they can bring you to a group and help you get over your halitophobia.
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thissux
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 1:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Deebo, Higher Thoughts and everyone else, I went to the gym today, trying to get my life back. I still get plenty of nose rubs, or people will touch their nose. I saw an old employer at the gym and we spoke a few times, he did not rub his nose, but I did share my worries. He said that major problems like that come from medical conditions (I told him I had reflux). I then asked him on a scale from 0 to 10 (10 being worst) what my number was. He said a negative 5, so lower than a 0. I saw others at the gym rub their nose as I walked by and this scared me. At the grocery store I did not see as much of itl, here and there. People do itch their nose, as Doctor Oz says at least 5 times per hour. Now my biggest fear is going back to my family practitioner to see what he says now. He said I had a problem before. My mom said if he says it is back she will ring his neck (not literally). I saw a guy rubbing his nose alot at the gym when I was close, but also when I was far away. Maybe a cold? I complemented a girl on her dog outside and she gave me a big nose rub. Now, do people rub their nose when something stinks? Or do they back away, retreat? Do they just touch their nose?
Also, if I had room filling breath, could those women at the rehab sit there and sniff my breath with their nose in my mouth 5 times once right after the other without looking sick and telling me they could talk to me all day long? Wouldn't bad halitosis be next to impossible to sniff like that? Clue me in guys. Thanks to you all, much respect
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mike987
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 3:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

All you get is nose rubs? If that's it, you should start doing new tests, or try to get past it.

If your breath isn't bad enough to make people pull their head away, suddenly hold up and leave their hands at their nose, or actually say that your breath smells like farts, then it's probably not worth worrying about.

Non chronic breath people have occasional BB. Chew sugarfree gum, etc and enjoy not having your BB man.
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meowkity1
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am going through the same thing. Every where I go, people sneeze, cough and rub even when my mouth is closed. I truly cannot take it anymore. Im getting all of these reactions even a day after getting my teeth cleaned. I feel hopeless, and I just posted in the venting section
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thissux
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 7:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So I am still trying to get a handle on this. I am planning to go to my family doctor as I feel he will be honest with me. Can bb also cause people to "sniffle" as though they have a cold or allergies? What if I talked to someone for lets say 20 minutes and then they rubbed their nose? However, I have also had where I said something to someone and immediately they did a hard nose rub?
In everyone's opinion, could a person (several people, the women I was in rehab with) voluntarily pretty much insert their nose in my mouth and have me talk, breathe, exhale hard and stay there for 10 seconds or even longer? If I had room filling bb - could they handle that and smile and looked relaxed and tell me it is a zero? Then later out in public I say something or am standing close to someone and they scratch the side of their nose or rub their nose? This is so frustrating. Sometimes I get no reaction. Please help my bb family! Hugs
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