Bad Breath Halitosis Forum

This whole situation has got the better of me. Please forgive me in advance for any angry vibes which may come across while you read this.

I don't know what to do. Hopefully someone here can help me.

Short version: Therabreath grants me a refund of $390 which I request by voicemail. After I make another purchase that day, they re-charge my debit card $390 for the previous order on top of $459 for the new order. Now they claim I need to return the the $390 order which they accidentally shipped, before they will refund me again. The problem is they already did refund me, I have no money left since they charged me without permission, plus I shouldn't need to ship anything back since someone charged my card without consent after they had already refunded it.

What would you do if you were in my position?

Full story: (24 points)

1. 1. I go to TB.com, order 12 bottles of regular mouthwash for $190.
   2. The next day I leave a voicemail to change the shipping address as they automatically took the one from PayPal.
   3. They confirm that the package has not yet left the facility and the shipping address has been updated.
   4. Day 3, I get an email - they now have a buy 2, get 1 free special.
   5. I decide to request a refund for order 1 in order to get the promotion instead.
   6. They give me a refund of $190 ON THE PHONE.
   7. I order $390, but use a coupon which cancels the promotion. I don't notice this.
   8. A few days later, I get an email that my order has been shipped - but only 2 of each item.
   9. It is the weekend. They are not open. I leave a voicemail explaining the coupon cancelled the promotion, requesting a refund. I say AS SOON AS I GET THE REFUND, I WILL MAKE ANOTHER ORDER.
   10. Monday morning I wake up - someone got the voicemail and $390 has been refunded to my bank account - sweet! They must have reversed the shipment with their shipping company. Yes!!!
   11. Monday morning, everything is settled. They cancelled the shipping and refunded both orders 1 ($190) and order 2 ($390). Now I can make a final 3rd order using the promotion.
   12. As soon as I get the refund, as promised, I finally make my order for the buy 2 get 1 free promotion. A total of $459.
   
   Here is where it gets messy.
   
   13. MONDAY NIGHT, I try to buy groceries at Walmart - but my card keeps getting denied. For some reason, I do not have sufficient funds in my account even though I should have $150.
   14. I login to online banking to find that I have been charged a second time for the order which had already been refunded ($390). They RECHARGED without notifying me and without my consent.
   15. Since I have already ordered $459 on top of this new charge of $390, my bank account is now -$250 and I am charged $60 insufficient funds from my bank as I do not have money to deposit.
   16. My rent is also due TODAY, and I do not have any money.
   17. I go through hell, and finally find someone who will lend $700 just to pay my rent and buy groceries.
   18. ORDER 1 is delivered to the PayPaL (WRONG) address. They told me they had updated the address, and later they cancelled shipping and refunded, but the package still arrived, and at the wrong address. Furthermore, I need TB PLUS, the original is not as effective and practically useless for me at this point!!!
   19. A few days later, ORDER 2 is delivered after they had refunded and recharged me. However, I do not have enough money to ship the items back, and the box is HUGE and will cost a fortune to ship back to them within 30 days. Plus the order was never supposed to come as I have been refunded.
   20. ORDER 3 is delivered. This is the only order I am supposed to get.
   21. I call TB over the course of the past 45 days. They continue trying to spin circles around the truth, even after I call out the 3 secretaries (Ruth, Jasmine and Amy (Manager)) OVER AND OVER on their lies, yet they continue to deny even though they know the truth.
   22. I file a claim with my bank, who contacts them and they admit they refunded $390 into my account even though they deny it on the phone with me to this very day.
   23. The bank tells me I reported the wrong charge (it is true), I accidentally reported the one that got refunded instead of the second (fraudulent) one.
   24. I call them today (just before writing this) and they are in denial the same as before. They refuse to admit they charged me without consent, they still deny ever refunding me (even though they admitted it to my bank) and they refuse to provide me with Dr. Katz line to speak with him directly.

Summary: I got refunded for $190 of product I do not need and they told me they cancelled, but sent to the wrong address where I no longer live. I got refunded $290 for an order which they told me they cancelled, but they recharged fraudulently me later that day. Before they fradulently charged me, I already placed a 3rd order for $490. Now I have no money left to return the items even if I wanted to (I have no reason to return them as it is their mistake), and they continue to deny any wrongdoing when it is 100% their fault.

Final note:[/b] Understand we got into many serious arguments. At this point, I have been very angry on multiple occasions with all 3 secretaries on the phone trying to get my money back. They are temaing up against me claiming "we have no record of a second transaction". After they put my account in the hole -$250, I don't even have enough money to ship the items back even if I wanted to. However, that isn't necessary as the charge is 100% FRAUDULENT to begin with.

Will there be hidden repurcussions as these secretaries are teaming up on me, I am afraid they will manipulate Dr. Katz himself that I am trying to scam and I prefer to avoid such a thing from happening. Again, they refuse to provide his direct line claiming "he does not speak with customers". HAHAHA. If only he knew what has happened, he seems like a great businessman, I would definitely get a full refund.

What would you do if you were in my position?

Call your credit card company and tell them to reverse the charges. They work for you, not the companies. They don't ***k around. You'll have your money back instantly. Ship back anything you might receive from Therabreath and document proof of it just in case they make a stink. But first don't pay for the return shipping, once you get your money back ask Therabreath to send shipping labels because you're not paying for their mistake. They will do it if they want their product back.

If you paid with your Debit card (which sounds like the case,) then you might not be able to do that so easily. Try to speak with your bank's manager in person by making an appointment. Explain what happened and see if he/she will handle it personally. If he is uncooperative then mention you will be switching banks if they can't protect you from what is obvious fraud. There are also a bunch of state and federal offices for fraud victims to contact, and sometimes they'll even call them directly and have them reverse the charges. These shady companies will often cut their losses and refund you when you involve people that can make life more difficult for them. Finally, if no progress has been made, threaten legal action. Bluff or not, them hiring a lawyer is going to cost much more than what they lose from refunding you, and that threat alone is often enough to get them to act.

What you do now is contact your state attorney and claim this company fraudulently charged you. Contact anyone that is remotely related to fraud cases, both state-wide and federally. Contact the Better Business Bureau. The more heat you can put on them the faster they'll want to bury this whole situation.

We need a stickie to alert everyone Dr Katz, Smarthmouth, TheraBreath, BreathRX are a gang of crooks. Their products do not work...period!!!

Johnv713 wrote:We need a stickie to alert everyone Dr Katz, Smarthmouth, TheraBreath, BreathRX are a gang of crooks. Their products do not work...period!!!

I'm sure some work OK, but they aren't the cures they tout them as. They're basically expensive, short-lasting Listerine. Plenty of cheap OTC treatments are far more effective such as Hydrogen Peroxide, diluted Bleach, Tea Tree Oil, Aspirin crushed & brushed into the teeth, etc. I got the impression that the OP has used Therabreath before, so if it works for him, then whatever. If they lose effectiveness then he should try the proven OTC stuff that we've all been relying on. I tried the Smartmouth stuff and it was useless and expensive.

ttylxman2 wrote:

Johnv713 wrote:We need a stickie to alert everyone Dr Katz, Smarthmouth, TheraBreath, BreathRX are a gang of crooks. Their products do not work...period!!!

I'm sure some work OK, but they aren't the cures they tout them as. They're basically expensive, short-lasting Listerine. Plenty of cheap OTC treatments are far more effective such as Hydrogen Peroxide, diluted Bleach, Tea Tree Oil, Aspirin crushed & brushed into the teeth, etc. I got the impression that the OP has used Therabreath before, so if it works for him, then whatever. If they lose effectiveness then he should try the proven OTC stuff that we've all been relying on. I tried the Smartmouth stuff and it was useless and expensive.

I don't know what to do. All 3 secretaries are in on this. I told them I will report to every online authority, etc. They do not care. I asked multiple times to speak to Dr. Katz direct and "he doesn't speak with customers..." this is a $1,200 mistake and he can't speak with me? They don't want him to hear the truth. So they will try to manipulate him if I file a fraud claim and it could come back to bite me if you know what I mean. I just don;t know what to do. I have never in my entire life, as far as I can remember anyway, dealt with such unprofessional staff. Speechless.

The first time using TB was most effective. Same with TUNG brush. And now they are both alright, but not like the first time. Listerine lasts only 5 minutes for me. The alcohol dries the mouth. I ordered a variety of products from TB including: gum (works OK, but dries out the mouth), probiotics (very minimal effect noticed, if any), toothpaste works quite well, Xylitol lozenges (work amazingly, but only last 10 minutes), and finally TB Plus mouthwash works well. I sometimes carry a pocket-sized Listerine bottle without the label. It is quite discreet, and you can safely swallow TB Mouthwash so rinse it around inconspicuously then swallow to get the throat as well. If I were you I would look for long-lasting Xylitol saliva-producing lozenges from other companies. These ones work so great other than the fact they only last 10 minutes as mentioned above. They produce so much saliva in your mouth like a river, it keeps the mouth fresh.

I think your bank is going to be the best ally you have in this. Follow the advice in my previous post and see how that goes. Harass your bank to reverse the charges, do not let it go. Make the bank manager's life hell if you have to. It was a fraudulent charge and it needs to be reversed, period. As long as you maintain with persistence that this is true, eventually your bank will have to cave in. Scammers are never going to be as persistent as a customer who was truly wronged.

ttylxman2 wrote:I think your bank is going to be the best ally you have in this. Follow the advice in my previous post and see how that goes. Harass your bank to reverse the charges, do not let it go. Make the bank manager's life hell if you have to. It was a fraudulent charge and it needs to be reversed, period. As long as you maintain with persistence that this is true, eventually your bank will have to cave in. Scammers are never going to be as persistent as a customer who was truly wronged.

It's not getting the money back that is the problem. That will be easy. The charge was not authorized. Period.

However, what I am afraid of is the secretaries will lie to Dr. Katz. If he thinks I filed a false claim just to get my $400 back, who knows what could happen. I did nothing wrong, but the 3 secretaries don't want to take responsibility, and I don't want to take any chances as they know my address...

Attraction wrote:

ttylxman2 wrote:I think your bank is going to be the best ally you have in this. Follow the advice in my previous post and see how that goes. Harass your bank to reverse the charges, do not let it go. Make the bank manager's life hell if you have to. It was a fraudulent charge and it needs to be reversed, period. As long as you maintain with persistence that this is true, eventually your bank will have to cave in. Scammers are never going to be as persistent as a customer who was truly wronged.

It's not getting the money back that is the problem. That will be easy. The charge was not authorized. Period.

However, what I am afraid of is the secretaries will lie to Dr. Katz. If he thinks I filed a false claim just to get my $400 back, who knows what could happen. I did nothing wrong, but the 3 secretaries don't want to take responsibility, and I don't want to take any chances as they know my address...

I think you're being a bit paranoid. Katz doesn't care, he pays people to do that for him. I doubt he is even in the same building that had the secretaries you were speaking to. His net worth is 3.3 billion dollars. Do you really think he gives a crap about you or your $400? Get your money back and forget about that shady ass company. They won't do anything.

I agree....dont know if he is billionare, but he is millionare for sure.....I saw how many boxes go out each day from his office 10 years ago.....

yes you are too paranoid, nobody cares about it....talk to bank they can reverse the costs I think

Jimi Stein wrote:I dont know if he is billionare

He is, I looked it up. He is worth 3.3 billion dollars.

where did you look it up?

Jimi Stein wrote:where did you look it up?

http://www.forbes.com/profile/daryl-katz/

ttylxman2 wrote:

Jimi Stein wrote:where did you look it up?

http://www.forbes.com/profile/daryl-katz/

It's Harold Katz, not Daryl Katz.

Attraction wrote:

ttylxman2 wrote:

Jimi Stein wrote:where did you look it up?

http://www.forbes.com/profile/daryl-katz/

It's Harold Katz, not Daryl Katz.

Oh, whoops. Was sure it was him because it even says he is a doctor and got rich off pharmacy stuff. Quite the coincidence.

ttylxman2 wrote:

Attraction wrote:

ttylxman2 wrote:
http://www.forbes.com/profile/daryl-katz/

It's Harold Katz, not Daryl Katz.

Oh, whoops. Was sure it was him because it even says he is a doctor and got rich off pharmacy stuff. Quite the coincidence.

In any case, definitely a multimillionaire.