My cure after 8 years of misery!!

[NOTANYMORE]

I'd go to an allergist and have them run the skin prick test on your arms. You will have immediate results as to what, if any thing, you are allergic too. If it's nothing obvious (think it was 63pricks for things like feather,dust, etc.), like me, then they will most likely just classify it as "chronic PND, or chronic sinusitis" and prescribe you a nasal steroid, antihistamine combo. Tell them you use a neti-pot and you already tried the OTC medications like MUCINEX. Make them aware that you have exhausted ALL non prescription methods and that you STILL think it's chronic PND. GOOD LUCK.

Let me know how it goes.

[KeepTrying09]

Yes, people CAN get a yeast infection anywhere in/on there body but who ever heard of someone getting chronic halitosis from a VAGINAL yeast infection?

Well, I don't think a vaginal yeast infection will cause bad breath, but if you get a vaginal yeast infection, then clearly your body is having a difficult time keeping yeast levels under control. Fortunately you can see a vaginal yeast infection (at least I think you can since i'm not a girl), but you cannot see a yeast infection that is in your intestines, esophagus, sinuses, or any other internal part of the body (without a medical examination anyway). I'd say it's reasonable to assume that if you had an external yeast infection, there is a probability that you could also have an internal yeast infection as well.

So IF you are the 1%'er who HAS oral candidiasis WITHOUT showing any signs....I.E. painful white patches....then by all means get it checked out. However, if you just have a white coating, don't ASSUME and FREAK out about it be a "yeast infection" because the chances are extremely remote.

I agree somewhat. I think the majority of white coating on the tongue is just the accumulation of gunk, such as dead skin cells, bacteria, food particles, etc. It's just strange though because a lot of people who take anti fungals report that the white coating on their tongue clears up. If the white coating was not yeast related, why would anti fungals clear it up?

[NOTANYMORE]

It's just strange though because a lot of people who take anti fungals report that the white coating on their tongue clears up. If the white coating was not yeast related, why would anti fungals clear it up?

I've done a bit of research and I have yet to find anyone on this forum who has been permanently cured by taking anti-fungal medication......besides you of course. The white on the tongue goes away while on the medication but comes back when finished. I believe the reason for this is b/c we ALL have yeast in our mouths......every one of us. In fact we ALL have yeast in our bodies as well. We don't all have a yeast INFECTION however, so the white comes back as part of your normal condition. If, (and this is a big if), it goes away for good, then you TRULY had a full blown YEAST INFECTION---1% chance.

I think your intentions are good and I mean you no disrespect but in a lot of cases I truly believe you are doing more harm than good. You are giving people drugs that people can, at the very least, be extremely allergic to, and can interfere with other medications they may be taking, knowing good and well, that they aren't going to tell a doctor they're taking said medications. Do you know WHY doctors are reluctant to prescribe medications? It is because you build up a tolerance to drugs. So later on in life, when you TRULY NEED those drugs, such as metronidazole, for a legitimate and potentially life threatening illness, your body will RESPOND WELL to them. Oh, and here's a bit of irony for you if you're trying to get rid of your "white tongue", how about a "black hairy one" instead......

High doses and/or long-term systemic treatment with metronidazole is associated with the development of black hairy tongue, leukopenia, neutropenia, increased risk of peripheral neuropathy and/or CNS toxicity.[3]

Sorry for the rant, and the sarcasm, but you show me someone who has been "cured" by anti-fungals, and I'll show you a post a couple of weeks later by that same person saying their BB is back.

[guzler]

NOTANYMORE i don't agree with you about what you said regarding keeptrying i had asked him to send me biozole, he refuse to send it to me because i have diabeties he looked at my profile and decided not to even though i insisted . keep trying is the best guy in this forum .

[KeepTrying09]

NOTANYMORE i don't agree with you about what you said regarding keeptrying i had asked him to send me biozole, he refuse to send it to me because i have diabeties he looked at my profile and decided not to even though i insisted . keep trying is the best guy in this forum .

Hey Guzler. Thanks for the kind words and vote of confidence. I appreciate it.

I've done a bit of research and I have yet to find anyone on this forum who has been permanently cured by taking anti-fungal medication......besides you of course. The white on the tongue goes away while on the medication but comes back when finished. I believe the reason for this is b/c we ALL have yeast in our mouths......every one of us. In fact we ALL have yeast in our bodies as well. We don't all have a yeast INFECTION however, so the white comes back as part of your normal condition. If, (and this is a big if), it goes away for good, then you TRULY had a full blown YEAST INFECTION---1% chance.

Permanently cured of what, bad breath or white tongue? I assume you mean bad breath, but since we were talking about white tongue i'm not sure. Please clarify.

I'm not sure but I think what you are saying is that having a white tongue is a normal condition because we all have yeast in our mouths. If so I would have to disagree with you, but maybe you could expand on what you said above.

I think your intentions are good and I mean you no disrespect but in a lot of cases I truly believe you are doing more harm than good. You are giving people drugs that people can, at the very least, be extremely allergic to, and can interfere with other medications they may be taking, knowing good and well, that they aren't going to tell a doctor they're taking said medications. Do you know WHY doctors are reluctant to prescribe medications? It is because you build up a tolerance to drugs. So later on in life, when you TRULY NEED those drugs, such as metronidazole, for a legitimate and potentially life threatening illness, your body will RESPOND WELL to them.

Of course I respect your opinion. Everyone is entitled to have one. It's just I fundamentally disagree with you. If you read any of my posts on this forum (although 244 posts is a lot to go through), I have repeatedly explained the possible risks of taking prescription drugs. I have even provided links to reputable medical websites listing all possible side effects and drug interactions that can arise from taking any of the prescription meds i'm offering. And yes, I have even declined to send some people medications because I have become aware of underlying conditions they have (ex. Guzler). I have laid out all the information I can on the prescription medications i'm offering. I can't control whether people read that information or not, but I believe that the majority of people are wise enough to do so and make an informed, educated decision for themselves.

You say that i'm offering drugs that people can be extremely allergic to. Ok, well, what if I were offering peanuts or shellfish. People can be extremely allergic to those too. What if I were offering Aspirin. It's an over the counter drug but people can be extremely allergic to that as well. The point is people can be allergic to anything. People don't know they are allergic to something until they actually take it, eat it, or are around it. If I eat peanuts and have an allergic reaction, then I would say "Wow, I'm allergic to peanuts, I'm never gonna eat those again." The same is true with prescription medications. If I take any prescription medication and have an allergic reaction to it, i'm gonna say "Wow, I'm not taking that prescription medication again." I would hope that if anyone had an allergic reaction to a medication, they would not be foolish enough to continue taking it...

What you said about why doctors are reluctant to prescribe medications, I totally disagree with you on that one. For example, do you really think that doctors are reluctant to prescribe antibiotics to people because they have a fear that people will become resistant to them? Come on, I could walk into a doctor's office tomorrow, tell him I had a sore throat, and he would have no hesitation to prescribe me with an antibiotic. Doctor's give out antibiotics like candy nowadays. Even if someone goes to the doctor's office with a cold, the doctor will prescribe them antibiotics. COME ON, a cold is a virus, antibiotics do absolutely nothing for viruses, yet doctors give them out to people who have colds! It's unbelievable really. The reason that doctors don't give out anti fungal medications to people as often as antibiotics is because they believe the only people who suffer from Candida infections are people with AIDS, Cancer patients, or any other patient who is severely immunocompromised. It's a medical misconception that is shared by the vast majority of the medical community.

Oh, and here's a bit of irony for you if you're trying to get rid of your "white tongue", how about a "black hairy one" instead......

High doses and/or long-term systemic treatment with metronidazole is associated with the development of black hairy tongue, leukopenia, neutropenia, increased risk of peripheral neuropathy and/or CNS toxicity.[3]

So would you consider taking Metronidazole anywhere between 5-10 days as long term? Because that's the most I've sent out to anyone here so far. Besides, what you are quoting are potential side effects, which subside after Metronidazole is stopped. Even if someone did get a black hairy tongue during treatment, it's not gonna last forever.

Sorry for the rant, and the sarcasm, but you show me someone who has been "cured" by anti-fungals, and I'll show you a post a couple of weeks later by that same person saying their BB is back.

I will show you myself, because I have been cured for a little over two years now.

Don't be sorry for your rant. I like to rant too sometimes. But if you are gonna rely on this forum as the definitive answer as to whether people who have taken anti fungals are cured of bad breath or not, then I'm afraid you will always be lead to believe that anti fungals are useless. I could say the same for any other possible cure too. Therabreath, BreathRx, tonsil removal, wisdom teeth removal, herbs, vitamins, you name it. Look at how many people on this forum have tried all of these things, only to come back and say "Nevermind, it didn't work for me".

The point is, of course if it didn't work people are going to come back to this forum, because they are still looking for their cure. The majority of people who are cured usually never return to the forum unfortunately. I really wish they would, because it would provide a lot of hope to those people who are still suffering. That's the only reason I came here. I don't have bad breath anymore because I found my cure. I could have never come to this forum and just gone on about my life. But I decided that I owed it to people to tell them my story. I imagine it's the same reason that you came to this forum too.

I originally started offering anti fungals because that's what cured me, but later on started offering antibiotics because I had read (on this forum) from some who said antibiotics helped cure them. Maybe only 1 out of 10 people will be cured by these prescription meds, maybe 1 out of 20, or 1 out of 30. Heck, maybe even 1 out of 100. I really don't know. But I do believe that people who suffer from bad breath have the right to at least try them. And I do know that anyone who is cured of bad breath is going to feel like they have their life back again. It doesn't matter what their cure is, it just matters that they finally found it.

Finally, I wanted to thank you for coming back and posting your cure. I am glad that you found your cure as I would not wish this condition on anyone. So congrats to you. I'm sure some people will benefit from the things you mentioned worked for you and I would definitely recommend that they try your methods. It's clear that you are not just a one time poster, and you seem to truly be interested in helping people, so again, welcome to the forum and thanks for sharing your success story. It gives much needed hope.

[halitosisux]

NOTANYMORE, you have provided lots of valuable feedback. Congratulation on finding your cure and taking the time to inform others of your discoveries and experiences. I agree with and can relate to a lot of what you say but unfortunately since you've suffered for 8 years and only made 16 posts on here your one-track mind and ignorance with regards to constructive discussions on the subject becomes apparent. But please dont let what I'm about to say detract from the effort you've put in to explain what happened to you and your opinions on the subject. I hope you can appreciate some of my constructive criticism as well as praise for what you have achieved.

I went to see my doctor about my nasal drip and was told to quit the meds because i was getting nose bleeds and I thought my PND was gone anyway. Well guess what? Yeah, since I'm not on friggin MEDS, my saliva was flowing even better and my breath was even better.

Are you sure you are not confused as to what PND actually is in comparison to simply having a dry mouth/thick saliva?

So I said to myself, HEY STUPID, MAYBE CUT BACK ON THE CAFFIENE AND SEE WHAT HAPPENS. THis was the hardest thing to do.

Compared to the efforts people make to find out their cause, this is an insult.

I can safely report that after doing this for 1 week, my tongue is pink and my breath is great!

1 week is not enough to safely report anything regarding BB.

I eat tons of protein. This alone can cause bad breath (ketosis)

Too right it can.

I was only talking about ORAL candidiasis, not any other type. Yes, people CAN get a yeast infection anywhere in/on there body but who ever heard of someone getting chronic halitosis from a VAGINAL yeast infection?

You clearly haven't the faintest idea, or this is pure ignorance on the point KeepTrying is trying to make.

The white on the tongue goes away while on the medication but comes back when finished. I believe the reason for this is b/c we ALL have yeast in our mouths......every one of us. In fact we ALL have yeast in our bodies as well. We don't all have a yeast INFECTION however, so the white comes back as part of your normal condition.

Read below.

Most people with breath problems have impeccable oral hygiene otherwise. SO IT"S NOT YOUR TEETH OR GUMS!! DON"T WORRY ABOUT IT!!

This has to be the worst piece of advice on BB I've ever seen

A relatively low percentage of people with GERD experience chronic halitosis, it's just that research is coming out which shows that the medications people take to avoid GERD (like ppi's) are much more likely to cause bad breath.

This could, indirectly, turn out to be the most important piece of information ever regarding chronic BB.

I'd say it's reasonable to assume that if you had an external yeast infection, there is a probability that you could also have an internal yeast infection as well.

True, but probably only in terms of susceptibility to candidiasis.

The point is, of course if it didn't work people are going to come back to this forum, because they are still looking for their cure. The majority of people who are cured usually never return to the forum unfortunately. I really wish they would, because it would provide a lot of hope to those people who are still suffering. That's the only reason I came here. I don't have bad breath anymore because I found my cure. I could have never come to this forum and just gone on about my life. But I decided that I owed it to people to tell them my story. I imagine it's the same reason that you came to this forum too.

I Totally agree and can relate to you there.

My general thoughts on this discussion:-
I believe that the overall coating on the tongue is the combination of many different factors. The surface of the tongue evolved into what it is for a reason. The papillae continously slough away their cells in a similar process of rejuvenation as that of the nails and hair. The balance inside the mouth between different factors such as hydration, immune health, general appetite, food types consumed, chemistry and other biological factors all determine the coating we have at any given time.

This is why doctors still like to look at the tongue for signs of local disease as well as a barometer of general health purely for the impact each of these important health related factors will have on our tongue coating.

It just so happens that the mouth is home to hundreds of different species of bacteria and types of fungus. Its no coincidence that the tongue surface has evolved into the structure that it is. The presense of these microbes are essential to our healthy functioning and any disturbance to the balance will have an impact on the coating due to unfavourable over-dominance of one or the other. Most oral hygiene measures, such as tongue scraping and antibacterial mouthwashes are actually creating this type of constant imbalance - infact that's KATZ & CO secret to their success, to get people hooked on the perpetuating cycle of usage, of ending up with an increase in coating and subsequently worsened bad breath situation (unless of course you happen to just be a typical KATZ customer you see in adverts who is only worrying about their coffee/garlic breath problem)

The thicker the coating (for whatever the reason may be) the more absorbant and anaerobic the surface becomes. That's why the mostly undisturbed far back of the tongue generally smells the worst (not because of natural levels of PND that EVERYONE has). And this may be the only reason why some who take antifungals/antibiotics feel their BB is reduced (usually temporarily) and most probably for no reason other than an improvement in any bad tastes in the mouth which have been associated with a particular case of BB.

The battle for position and prominance between bacteria and fungi is never ending. The same balance also goes on constantly inside the intestines. So of course, any disturbance through the use of medications is going to affect this delicate balance in the same way.

KT is helping people, through offering his own insight and experiences of successfully curing his own BB, leading others to make their own informed decisions whether to try these medications in the hope they may be able to mimic his success. Even though I have also voiced my opinion against this trial and error approach to using such potentially risky medications, weighing it all up, in my opinion the risks involved GREATLY outweigh the insight and potential benefit that may come out of trying them - Nothing ventured, nothing gained - People's lives are not only wasting but the torture of living in this limbo superficial existence is what people are so desperate to escape.
I just wish that there could be more activity on here, in terms of discussions and ideas. Whether it be symptoms, past experiences etc. constructive criticisms, new ideas and QUESTIONING existing concepts.

If there are no direct local disease processes going on with the lungs, stomach/esophagus, sinuses, tonsils/adenoids, teeth & gums, and standard checks have confirmed there are no liver/thyroid/diabetes/kidney/immune system (etc) problems, then in my opinion there can only be 2 other possibilities. One is a particular (and possibly as yet unidentified) enzymatic deficiency, in the same way that primary TMAU causes BB, or that there has been an unrecoverable disturbance or overgrowth of the intestinal microbial flora, for example, through the prolonged use of antibiotics, or through the impact of an undiagnosed digestive disorder, such as hypochlorhydria. I dont think hormonal changes/disturbances are a direct cause, but possibly may have an indirect or exacerbatitve affect elsewhere, such as the digestive system or even the gums (yes the gums).

I dont think its got anything to do with mercury poisoning or similar toxicity - If chronic BB could be directly caused by mercury poisoning and whatever other similar chemical poisoning from modern life, a proven connection would long since have been established - But it hasn't. But no doubt a reduction in toxic chemical buildup inside the body is likely to lead to overall health improvements and subsequent possible BB improvements. Any links between BB and mercury poisoning are probably nothing more than the increased likelihood of having a hidden rot from a failed or badly filled tooth or root canal. The more fillings, the worse the general care of dentition and maybe there is correlation between that.

[NOTANYMORE]

Hey guys and gals. Wow, look at all the attention! You are too kind. I appreciate the comments, both positive and negative. I believe these are the kinds of discussions that can lead to positive outcomes for people and maybe even breakthroughs.
Please let me address a couple of things.....

I went to see my doctor about my nasal drip and was told to quit the meds because i was getting nose bleeds and I thought my PND was gone anyway. Well guess what? Yeah, since I'm not on friggin MEDS, my saliva was flowing even better and my breath was even better.

Are you sure you are not confused as to what PND actually is in comparison to simply having a dry mouth/thick saliva?

Perhaps you are assuming I am ignorant due to my low post count? I failed to give detailed accounts of the entire 8 years of halitosis, so please forgive my lack of detail in accounting for the PND. I had most of the classic symptoms of PND and verification through visual observation by an Allergist. After about 3months on the nasal steroids I noticed I no longer had a lump in the throat feeling, coughing in the morning, or occasional trickles down the throat. I started getting nose bleeds due to the drying effect of the steroids so when I went to see the doctor about it, she took me off. Well, I had already shown some improvement with regards to the BB and white tongue but being off the steroids really helped restore saliva.

So I said to myself, HEY STUPID, MAYBE CUT BACK ON THE CAFFIENE AND SEE WHAT HAPPENS. THis was the hardest thing to do.

Compared to the efforts people make to find out their cause, this is an insult.

Not if the person is in complete denial about what it is they ingest everyday. Some people are looking for things to take to eliminate the halitosis when in fact the solution could be as simple as eliminating certain foods/drinks. In fact there is a poster on here (not naming), who took some anti fungal medication and "had success", then got off the meds and SMOKED SOME WEED, lol and the BB came back! So maybe if this person would just.....STOP SMOKING WEED and drink more water, they could be fixed! Also, check out this recent post .......viewtopic.php?t=2716., and notice HIS post count!
NEVER UNDERESTIMATE THE POWER OF DENIAL!

I can safely report that after doing this for 1 week, my tongue is pink and my breath is great!

1 week is not enough to safely report anything regarding BB.

This comment is totally subjective. How long then? It's been 3 weeks now, does that count? I have had several 1 day cures trying various outlandish things but never 3 weeks......in 8 years.

I was only talking about ORAL candidiasis, not any other type. Yes, people CAN get a yeast infection anywhere in/on there body but who ever heard of someone getting chronic halitosis from a VAGINAL yeast infection?

You clearly haven't the faintest idea, or this is pure ignorance on the point KeepTrying is trying to make.

I guess I need some clarification because I still don't understand what a yeast infection anywhere other than your mouth or perhaps your throat, has anything to do with halitosis.
If you are going to attempt to explain this, please no THEORIES!

Most people with breath problems have impeccable oral hygiene otherwise. SO IT"S NOT YOUR TEETH OR GUMS!! DON"T WORRY ABOUT IT!!

This has to be the worst piece of advice on BB I've ever seen

I'll give you this one. I actually regret typing it. If you have dental problems, by all means, get them fixed. It's just that from reading peoples stories (all over the internet), most people CLAIM that they have seen a dentist and brush and floss several times a day, etc. yet still have chronic BB. As I'm sure you're aware there are two schools of thought regarding halitosis and peroi.....yours and the the one about bone loss happening too far below the gum line to cause any noticeable change in breath smell. Seriously though, haven't you spoken with people who have just terrible teeth and gums, yet still don't have bad breath? Shouldn't they be cursed as well?

So here's the deal. I am extremely grateful for forums like this and people such as yourself and Keeptrying09. Although after years of searching no one GAVE me my cure, I am happy I had the internet to use a tool. I couldn't imagine going through it without an outlet (as I never told anyone except my wife) and a feeling that I wasn't alone.

Also, I'd like everyone to please forgive my strong opinions on certain things......like yeast and GERD, and the way I tend to lump everyone and everything together. I just urge people to look at more likely reasons for halitosis first. This whole yeast thing IMO is overblown and surely can't be the reason for BB in most cases.<----------damn, did it again!

[KeepTrying09]

So I said to myself, HEY STUPID, MAYBE CUT BACK ON THE CAFFIENE AND SEE WHAT HAPPENS. THis was the hardest thing to do.

Compared to the efforts people make to find out their cause, this is an insult.

Not if the person is in complete denial about what it is they ingest everyday. Some people are looking for things to take to eliminate the halitosis when in fact the solution could be as simple as eliminating certain foods/drinks. In fact there is a poster on here (not naming), who took some anti fungal medication and "had success", then got off the meds and SMOKED SOME WEED, lol and the BB came back! So maybe if this person would just.....STOP SMOKING WEED and drink more water, they could be fixed!

I totally agree that people must be conscious of what they put in their bodies when trying to fight off bad breath. "We are what we eat" as the old saying goes....

I think Hal (and forgive me Hal if I am putting words into your mouth) found it insulting just because you used the word stupid. I wouldn't say that people are stupid just because they might not make the best choices in regards to what they are putting in their bodies. Really sometimes people honestly don't know something they may be eating, drinking, or whatever might be doing more harm than good. For example, I used to eat both mushrooms and bread a lot back when I was suffering with bad breath. Did I know that these two foods might have been complicating my Candida infection? Absolutely not because I had no idea I had Candida in the first place. If I had known back then a Candida infection was causing my bad breath, I would have stopped eating these two things long ago. Was I stupid for eating them? No, I wasn't, because I didn't know any better.

And I'm not saying that everyone who eats bread and mushrooms has a problem with Candida. There are millions of people around the world who eat bread and mushrooms everyday and they have no problem with Candida whatsoever. But those people who have a susceptibility to Candida (like me) should not be eating those things. Just like anyone who has Diabetes, Celiac Disease, Irritable Bowel Syndrome, a lactose intolerance, or food allergies should stay away from certain foods as well.

I can safely report that after doing this for 1 week, my tongue is pink and my breath is great!

1 week is not enough to safely report anything regarding BB.

This comment is totally subjective. How long then? It's been 3 weeks now, does that count? I have had several 1 day cures trying various outlandish things but never 3 weeks......in 8 years.

I would have to agree with Hal that 1 week is not really enough time to accurately gauge if your bad breath is cured. The reason is, if you look all over this forum, you will see posts from people saying that they were cured, only to come back a week or two later saying "Nevermind". You even acknowledged this yourself.

I also don't think Hal was dismissing those people who claim to be cured after only a week. I think Hal and I would both agree that whatever the time frame, 1 week, 2 weeks, whatever, it is still a great achievement for someone who has suffered from bad breath long term. If someone can be cured short term, then or course there is hope that they can be cured long term.

And again I want to say congratulations that you have been cured for 3 weeks now. It is a remarkable experience i'm sure, and I pray your success will last forever.

I was only talking about ORAL candidiasis, not any other type. Yes, people CAN get a yeast infection anywhere in/on there body but who ever heard of someone getting chronic halitosis from a VAGINAL yeast infection?

You clearly haven't the faintest idea, or this is pure ignorance on the point KeepTrying is trying to make.

I guess I need some clarification because I still don't understand what a yeast infection anywhere other than your mouth or perhaps your throat, has anything to do with halitosis. If you are going to attempt to explain this, please no THEORIES!

Again, it's not that a vaginal yeast infection would directly cause bad breath. My point was that if one part of your body is susceptible to yeast, then there is a chance that other parts of your body are susceptible to yeast as well. And I don't think it has to be a full on yeast infection that can cause bad breath, it can simply just be an imbalance. For example, they say that 90% of bad breath is caused by bacteria on the tongue. Yet these people do not have a bacterial infection on their tongues. They just have an imbalance of bacteria. The same is true for yeast. Why does it have to be a full on infection before you have bad breath? Why couldn't it just be from an imbalance of yeast?

By the way I question that whole 90% figure, I was just using it to illustrate my point.

So here's the deal. I am extremely grateful for forums like this and people such as yourself and Keeptrying09.

Thank you, but you should include yourself amongst us because we are also grateful that you are sharing your success story as well.

Also, I'd like everyone to please forgive my strong opinions on certain things......like yeast and GERD, and the way I tend to lump everyone and everything together. I just urge people to look at more likely reasons for halitosis first. This whole yeast thing IMO is overblown and surely can't be the reason for BB in most cases.<----------damn, did it again!

LOL, well I won't argue that you have strong opinions, but that's what makes debate worthwhile, and the ultimate result of such debate is knowledge.

The point is that (again, as you have mentioned) there is no "magic bullet cure" that will work for everyone. Bad breath is complex, and there are so many things that can cause it. I have said it before, but I'll say it again, finding your cure requires that you make a checklist of possible causes, and then slowly start going through that checklist until you finally find your cause. I think all things on that checklist should be given equal importance, not just some (including yeast and GERD )

[NOTANYMORE]

Hey KT, thanks for the input. Just a quick note here......

NOTANYMORE wrote:
So I said to myself, HEY STUPID, MAYBE CUT BACK ON THE CAFFIENE AND SEE WHAT HAPPENS. THis was the hardest thing to do.

When I wrote that, I was only making fun of my self. I find that self deprecating humor lightens the mood but maybe it is lost in translation when typed. I don't wish to say that anyone on here is stupid by any means......

Thanks for the critique and no hard feelings.

NOTANYMORE

[halitosisux]

Hey guys, good to see such a healthy debate.
NOTANYMORE, I have just a few points to make and I'll try not to go into any theories. Firsly yeast/fungal infection inside the sinuses can apparantly cause the most horrendous BB. I'm also sure that a yeast overgrowth inside the intestines could lead to the absorption of foul contents into the bloodstream. Yeast infection leads to tissue and structural damage which can cause secondary bacterial problems. Just imagine that inside the sinuses.

Also, I think that everyone has their own level of susceptibility to BB for several reasons, but most likely regarding the particular populations of microbial species. That's why I think some people can get away with having a mouth full of rotten teeth and others can have the most minor problems but end up with sewer breath.

I also wish to clarify my remarks on the "stupid" comment. I was actually referring to the fact you mentioned it was "the hardest thing to do". Can you just imagine the willpower it takes to spend months on a raw diet for instance, or to endure the days of pain from a tonsillectomy (and 1% risk of fatality each tonsillectomy carries).

Even though I have also voiced my opinion against this trial and error approach to using such potentially risky medications, weighing it all up, in my opinion the risks involved GREATLY outweigh the insight and potential benefit that may come out of trying them

I made a blunder there, I meant to say "the risks involved are GREATLY outweighed by the...

[bbsux]

Great debate i love it , its very healthy and than you all for sharing your points.

Can you guys please comment either on my thread or here since you both seem to know what you are doing...

viewtopic.php?p=25604#25604

"I am open to try anything if enough people post it as this bb is the only thing that is stopping me from having a great life.. i am sure most of you can relate to this.

Here are my symptoms....

-Acidic mouth/taste
-PND (has gotten better after stopping dairy but in the mornings its really bad and thick and yellowish)
-metallic taste
-horrible taste at times, especially in morning., Sometimes when i swallow my own spit after my morning teeth brushing procedure which takes 25 minutes, its almost tastes like swallowing peace of dong (shit)...no wonder i get crazy reactions. Also it seems like the horrible taste while swallowing comes from the upper region of my mouth like from my sinus area (could be the PND that i am swallowing)
-Possible nasal smell (not confirmed) but sometimes even when i dont talk people sitting next to me will cough in the classroom.

Here is what i am doing so far.

-2-3 times a week i will irrigate my nose with salt and hydrogen peroxide which seems to clear up my sinuses.
-Keeping the sugar to a minimum , barely if ever eat any desert (maybe once a month)
-Only drinking water!!!, no juice, no sodas, no alcohol, no coffee etc etc
-I never smoked so that is not a issue
-Dairy intake is at a minimum (maybe eat one cheeseburger a month or something like that )
-Brush teeth twice a day (floss at nights) Routine includes: Scrape tongue, floss, brush teeth, Gargle with new Scope Outlast (what a joke if you have seen the commercial) and than gargle with hydrogen peroxide.

RESULTS from the above

-Tongue not as white as before but still white
-Reduced PND but not completely gone.
- While scraping my tongue and back of my throat i will notice that my PND starts to drip and its yellowish
- Brushing my teeth triggers my PND and i end up spitting out sticky mucus, sometimes its so thick and stick i would compare it to glue.
-Coughing around me has been improved by alot so seems like my nasal smell is improving (thank god atleast something is improving lol!)
-BB taste is still very horrible, 90% of the time my mouth either feels metallic or acidic.
-Still have BB as i am still getting reactions. Maybe it has improved by 5-10% at most


Possible Negatives
- I barely eat any vegetables as i cant stand them, i have to force my self to eat them as i hate the taste but am willing to force my self if that will help
- I eat alot of bread and pitas as i am from Easter Europe.
-I have had lot of dental work done on my teeth ??"

[NOTANYMORE]

Hey bbsux, I'm just curious, have you had any medical treatment for the PND? I believe PND in of itself can be THE major cause of BB for some people. Also, your diet is great so unless you are allergic to something you eat often(and don't know it), I don't see a problem there.

[halitosisux]

bbsux, I was going to ask you this question too, about your PND. There seems to be no mention of any ENT visits, but maybe you've mentioned it in other posts. Please try to list more information on things you've done and things you've tried. Yellow mucus or any coloured mucus is usually a sign that bacteria are putrifying your mucus within the nasal cavity.

Sorry if this sounds a bit insulting, but sometimes mucus that is sitting in the throat (as mucus tends to do while sleeping or while there may be stagnation for a while) can become coloured by food and drinks, even from consumption hours earlier. The same thing regarding odours - if your source of BB is the surface of your tongue, then any mucus that comes into contact with that is going to end up smelling the same. A good way to differentiate is to compare the difference to the mucus you blow out from your nose to that which appears in your throat. Basically I think its important to know whether its your mucus which smells bad, which in turn leads to a buildup of odour on your tongue, or your mucus doesn't smell bad, and vice versa. And if your mucus is the source of your odours, then that's where your investigations need to be focused on.

I know that even today, if I brush my tongue (which I never do) or do anything to irritate my throat, I immediately produce a thick sticky gluey mucus and almost feel as if I'm going to choke on it. But this ISNT PND. There is a difference. But I do suffer from PND (usually for the first few hours after waking lessening as the day goes on) because I suffer with dust allergy and I have a deviated septum with one side of my nose partially blocked. But fortunately my nasal mucus is usually completely odourless and colourless except for any which has been drying and stagnating near my nostrils occasionally. But overall my mucus is like a thickened form of saliva.

You stated that you wish you could talk to your mother about your problem. Is the reason you havent done so already because she wont admit you have one? Or is it because you havent dared to mention it to her or anyone else before? Either way, you really do need to confide in someone you trust on this problem, because its one we have no reliable way of quantifying for ourselves. There may be no correlation between what you think you have and what you ACTUALLY have.

You mentioned having a history of dental issues. Teeth and gums are usually the cause of BB for most people, purely because of their vulnerability, location and their susceptibility to situations which can cause BB, which dentists then fail to identify. Ensure you've ruled your teeth and gums out 100% beyond any doubt before even THINKING about other causes.

[NOTANYMORE]

I agree with the mucus smell. I used to have a foul odor coming from my nose (you can verify this for yourself by tucking your upper lip under your upper teeth and breathing in) and green phlegm, particularly in the morning. This condition was exacerbated by my chronic consumption of caffeine. After being treated my mucus is clear and no smell is evident in my nose.

I do have some white on the back of my tongue, but It doesn't smell horrible like it used to and isn't near as thick. Of course it is more prevalent in the morning, but no big deal. Upon speaking with my dentist, he told me most people have it and it's quite normal. If your tongue is completely white, that's a whole other issue.

[Truth Seeker]

Hi Everyone,

Food for thought…Here are few things that I have tried over the past 10 years to try cure my BB.

*Having an impeccable oral hygiene (like the rest of us )

* Using hydro-floss: to floss and to clean my sinuses – works great for PND

* Hydrogen peroxide – does kill all sorts of bacteria but may cause a rough tongue just like any other oxidizing solution/mouthwash

* Therabreath products. My first internet purchase ever – that was back in 2003 or 2004. I am glad I ordered the starter kit as it literally prevented me from “going over the edge”. Definitely reduced my BB significantly but NOT eliminated it. Also tried the Activ K12 probiotic – from my experience it did work but I had to keep using it to stay BB free. Hence, the monthly cost of 75 bucks was rather not acceptable to me and forced me to keep searching for a cheaper alternative. Though, I still use TB toothpastes and oral rinses on a regular basis. If you know any other product that worked for you and is more competitively priced please let me know.

* Eliminated dairy products

*Despite all things that I was implementing in my routine my tongue would still be covered with this whitish stuff so I researched what the cause might have been. Some of you identified that Candida is often responsible for BB. I believe that was the case with me. To tackle the problem, I started drinking APPLE CIDER VINEGAR (ACV). A half of teaspoon (approx. 2.5 mL) in 2 glasses of water (500mL) would be sufficient to notice changes. Some websites recommend 1-2 teaspoons in a glass of water but I am a firm believer that you should start slow (lower concentration) and increase the dosage with time if you choose so…

Why ACV??? Well because it is a cheap home remedy that solves multiple causes of BB. That is, it reduces/eliminates the following:

• Post Nasal Drip
• Candida Infections
• Acid Reflux / GERD
• And many more. For more info on ACV and other home remedies check this website. http://www.earthclinic.com/
You can use it as an oral rinse as well. Of course, dilute it, rinse/gargle and brush your teeth afterwards as it is an acidic solution after all. My tongue has never been so pink in over a decade.

• To get rid of that whitish coating some people brush their tongues with salt (look it up on earth clinic). I have a theory that it is iodine in salt that’s actually responsible for eliminating the coating. Just recently, I started supplementing with Lugol’s solution (type of iodine solution). So far so good but I should WARN YOU that you could mess yourself up if you start taking too much of it. DO an extensive RESEARCH on iodine and familiarize yourself with benefits and potential risks of supplementation with iodine. (check it on earth clinic and other websites. I found a very interesting paper on iodine on scribd.com – google it)
All in all, ACV has been extremely effective in eliminating the whitish coating on my tongue, and improving my overall health as it offers many other benefits.

I hope this might help a bit.

Cheers