Bad Breath Halitosis Forum

Archimonde wrote:

potty_mouth wrote: I think our mouths are more susceptible to this kind of invasion because of an underlying cause. Possibly due to a difficult-to-detect immune response which effects our entire secretory immune system, including our mouths. See viewtopic.php?t=4876

The other way round is more likely: oral bacteria from debris is weakening your immune system

It's possible, but not more likely. My immune system is overactive, not weakened exactly.
If it was purely an oral bacteria problem then I wouldn't react to yeast and dietary proteins in that way also.

thank you so much for this, searching. i have a hydrofloss machine, not a waterpik, and it doesn't have this kind of attachment. i just tried this using a regular tip and blasted the water a bit more gently (i find it hurts if i blast it at full speed against my soft oral tissues). what do you think.. does it have to be blasted at a harder pressure?

i also have trouble with gagging, so i can only do it for a few seconds. i did find though that if i stick the tip behind that glossopalatine arch (as described in the other thread that you got inspiration from), then turn on the water, it works a bit better in terms of gagging.

what are all the folds and pockets you irrigate? i can only find that glossopalatine arch. anything past it is too deep in my mouth and causes gagging for sure.

anyway, i did that after brushing and then irrigating my gumline and between my teeth. i used about 20 drops of grapefruit seed extract with about 700ml of water (instead of the saline solution you used). my mouth feels cleaner and less stinky, but it is hard to tell without getting feedback from someone. after doing this though, i found i had a lot of mucus at the back of my throat. i find thi happens often if i try to reach back there.. like if i scrape my tongue far back and then gargle with water, the mucus comes up. maybe it means the mucus is getting dislodged, i don't know. i also don't know why i have this mucus back there (PND, i guess?). do others not have this mucus?

do you have tonsil stones? people talk about it on here and i have seen photos of it but i do not have it, i think.. at least i have never seen anything like that in my mouth.

i am pretty sure my bb is oral-based as well. have been using a prescription tetracycline rinse for the past 2 weeks (almost done) and it worked at first but no longer really works, though it has reduced the bb. it's frustrating that nothing works though...

Hello ruch,

I use the Finkelstein finger test to determine the efficacy of oral cleaning. If I fail the test, I clean again. In the past, before using this routine I could manually dislodge a tonsil stone, or the precursor of a stone, i.e. a foul-smelling deposit that hadn’t yet solidified. The difficulty with this irrigation method is overcoming the gag reflex and successfully cleaning all anaerobic pockets, without the ability to clearly see all locations that require cleaning.

ruch wrote:i have a hydrofloss machine, not a waterpik, and it doesn't have this kind of attachment. i just tried this using a regular tip and blasted the water a bit more gently (i find it hurts if i blast it at full speed against my soft oral tissues). what do you think.. does it have to be blasted at a harder pressure?

The regular tip, which I use at the highest flow setting, is best used along the gum line where it meets the teeth. This regular tip discharge force is too high, and too needle-like, for the tongue or throat area.

ruch wrote:what are all the folds and pockets you irrigate?

The folds and pockets I irrigate are the tonsil crypts and the rearward, upper region around the uvula. Here I use the tongue attachment, and sometimes, the brush attachment.

thanks, searching! because i don't have a waterpik machine and cannot get that tip (i looked for an equivalent one for the hydrofloss machine but they don't have one), i just use the regular tip on a lower setting so the water pressure is not too hard. i don't know if it works or not but i guess we will see. i do find it helps to reach behind the gloss arch though since i can literally stick it in there and run it up and down along the arch. then i have been shooting water to the back of my throat and along the sides, etc all of this takes some getting used to but i find it gets easier each time. i then use a syringe (the kind without a needle.. it's the type of syringe used to administer oral medicine to babies, for example) and put it a bit of chlorhexidine (which i am still using as a rinse) in it, then squirt it into the gloss arch to kill off any bacteria there.

do you find that a lot of mucus comes up when accessing these back regions? i find everytime i do, i get a lot of mucus. it makes me think that could be a reason why rinses don't work all the time.. they cannot penetrate the mucus. however, it feels like more mucus comes up when i do access these regions either through the hydrofloss or through the syringe. i don't know much about oral anatomy - is this just because the mucus is getting dislodged and i just have a lot back there i didn't know about, or is it because more mucus is being formed as i do this? where does mucus get formed? anyone know?

also, searching, what's the Finkelstein finger test?

thanks!

ruch wrote:do you find that a lot of mucus comes up when accessing these back regions?
what's the Finkelstein finger test?

Hello ruch,

The amount of mucus generated hasn't seemed to change much. By using occasional nasal irrigation I believe that I have no blockage and flow is occurring normally.

The Finkelstein Finger test is simply touching, pressing, or squeezing, a tonsil with a finger, then smelling the finger to assess the odor of the material on, or in, the tonsil. This may help to zero-in on the location of the BB source.

The test is described on the second page of the article seen here: http://www.nupen.com.br/port/odontologi ... l_2004.pdf.

searching.. that is interesting. was it like that when you first started too? i wonder why i get so much mucus..

i also find that irrigating back there has not helped much for me. i wonder if it only works for those who have had or currently have tonsil stones. i have never had that issue.

i do use a neti pot as well as the spray bottle that you will with the same saline solution. it does help a bit but not entirely.

thanks for info on the f test!

ruch, I think any kind of irritation to any area of mucous membranes, such as those lining the throat, causes these actual tissues themselves to produce a very sticky layer of mucus to form.

Acid reflux (and vapour) will do this in the throat, as will gargling with mouthwash or brushing the tongue, or irrigation etc.

A lot of people will confuse this with PND when in fact the real PND is not above normal. The mucus they are aware of is bring produced in the throat, so it's not PND, it's just mucus secretions, which is a different thing.

halitosisux wrote:ruch, I think any kind of irritation to any area of mucous membranes, such as those lining the throat, causes these actual tissues themselves to produce a very sticky layer of mucus to form.

Acid reflux (and vapour) will do this in the throat, as will gargling with mouthwash or brushing the tongue, or irrigation etc.

A lot of people will confuse this with PND when in fact the real PND is not above normal. The mucus they are aware of is bring produced in the throat, so it's not PND, it's just mucus secretions, which is a different thing.

This information and some videos I posted in the NON acid reflux post, go hand in hand. I'd like to hear what you think about it, here or in that thread.

Jesus Christ, everybody is getting cured, who will visit our site if everyone is cured he he

Congrats

Do the donation as a thank you, much appreciated

@jimi, why I can't see my picture when I post comments? (like Archimonde)?

Don't worry bro, when I get a job after curing badbreath, I will donate

did you upload it? It should work, on the other hand, the site is old though, 6 years lol

@jimi, my account >> about you >> photo >> uploaded

I always thought you had to approve of it before it shows up

Maybe it's time for an update of the website? XD

halitosisux wrote:ruch, I think any kind of irritation to any area of mucous membranes, such as those lining the throat, causes these actual tissues themselves to produce a very sticky layer of mucus to form.

Acid reflux (and vapour) will do this in the throat, as will gargling with mouthwash or brushing the tongue, or irrigation etc.

A lot of people will confuse this with PND when in fact the real PND is not above normal. The mucus they are aware of is bring produced in the throat, so it's not PND, it's just mucus secretions, which is a different thing.

so does this mean it may be worsening the problem? more mucus in the throat and mouth = more proteins for the bacteria to feed on... and more bb?

i do get PND too as i sometimes feel mucus sliding down my throat.

I think more mucus in general will exacerbate things if your BB relates to the bacterial activity in your mouth and throat.

If your mucus relates to a chronic infection in your nose or sinuses then the mucus may already smell slighly and perhaps be streaming bacteria (and other things that make bad breath happen further along) onto the back of your tongue that otherwise wouldn't normally be there.

We have to bear in mind that lots of people have serious mucus problems and excessive PND, but yet they don't have BB.

So yes, more mucus than normal probably worsens thing.

I don't know how relevant this is, but I tried incubating some of my oral bacteria in a dish containing my post nasal drainage. Initially that dish containing the mucus/bacterial mix would smell of absolutely nothing. But after incubating it for a few hours, the smell was horrendous, and it smelled JUST like bad breath. I wish I was a microbiologist and could know the significance of such things. Is it the bacterial types, or the mucus that determines what odours get produced? We should put this to Dr. Aydinmur.

I may try incubating a sample of my oral bacteria with other types of protein rich mixtures, or things like blood etc.

hope it works for me ALSO

IM HAVENT LOSE HOPE IN DINDING A CURE