Hi everyone! First of all I want to say I am so sorry you're here
I wouldn't wish this curse on my worst enemy. You don't deserve the suffering this condition causes. Please read my novel, as I think a lot of what I have to say is important and I wish someone would have said it to me.I have been seeing a LOT of improvement over the last few months, and especially the last few weeks. I commented that I was near a cure and a few people were asking about what I was doing. I wasn't planning on making this most until this problem was securely GONE. However, upon further thought, even though I don't feel like it is 110% officially gone, I feel miles better than I used to and it has been confirmed at multiple times that I haven't smelled (though I think when I am feeling "worse" the smell may be creeping back in.. I'm not sure). A lot of my symptoms are either gone or getting better everyday and I started to feel like I may be "gatekeeping" information that may be incredibly helpful to people on here.
That said, I don't mean to be harsh in my post, or act like my way is the only way. All I know is that for 8 years I was doing things and approaching this problem very very wrong and I wish I had someone to give me some tough love along the way and slap some sense into me. If I had, I may have not wasted my entire 20's on this problem.
Some quick backstory on my version of this curse: It started when I was 21. I am now 30. It came up slowly, first started as a bad taste, then the coating started to become noticeable, and I began to notice reactions. My symptoms were/are: dry mouth, LOTS of sticky PND mucus coming from left nostril that would sit and collect in the back of my nose/throat/tongue, bad taste, white coating, slimy coating on tongue as well, and of course stinky breath. If I licked my wrist and smelled it, it would smell like gross vinegar.
About 9 months before all of this started I had my tonsils taken out due to an infection. I had contracted strep after giving oral sex to a man. They attempted to treat it with 2 weeks of antibiotics and 2 steroid shots. When that didn't work they ultimately took my tonsils out and I took antibiotics afterwards as well. Shortly before surgery I went on hormonal birth control, and then a few months later stopped taking it. I imagine this rollercoaster was harsh on my body. My diet was horrible before and after this. 6 months after surgery I went through a break up and started to consume a lot of alcohol due to the emotional affect it had on me. ALL of this is the PERFECT environment for bad bacteria and/or fungus to take hold of a body.
Which brings me to my first point... for years and years and years I was caught up in the idea that this was NOT coming from my mouth. I had been checked by dentists, only for them to tell me my gum health was pristine and I had no cavities. If I asked them about a bad taste/tongue coating they completely disregarded it and said everything looked fine and to just drink more water. Because of that, I was convinced it must be coming from deeper inside of me and I spent YEARS of my life focused on food intolerances, trying diet after diet that I could never stick to, acid reflux, and wasting money on detoxes and other supplements. I always had an intense oral hygiene routine and it never REALLY made a difference. However, it was always a little bit better, especially if I did neti pot rinses. Why I didn't take this into consideration I have no idea.
If you have any of my symptoms -- tongue coating, mucus, slimy coating, bad taste etc. The problem is in your mouth. It may be and probably is also in your gut, but the mouth is a part of the problem too. No matter what those idiot dentists tell you.
When you hear hoof beats, think horses not zebras. Meaning, that if you have bad breath the problem is probably simpler and more obvious than you think.
Horses: oral microbiome bacterial imbalance/gut imbalance/or both, tonsil stones, candida/thrush, acid reflux
Zebras: metabolic issues, genetic conditions, food intolerances, auto immune disorders etc.
If you stink like infection and sickness YOU ARE INFECTED AND SICK.
Something is incredibly out of whack within your body. It is 99% likely that it is something within your bodies microbiome, either in your mouth, in your gut or both. Your bodies microbiome is huge and complex. There are more bacteria on the surface of your skin than there are people in the world, so just think about how many there are in a bacteria rich environment like your mouth or your gut. Because of this, no ONE pill, detox, fast or diet is going to fix this. Bacteria and fungus are strong and smart and determined to live inside of you -- you MUST work harder, longer and smarter than them to even make a dent. If you are not willing to commit studying up on this, restricting yourself or committing to a specific protocol you might as well give up now.
For 8 YEARS I would try a diet for a week and then give up, claiming it must not work. I'd try pills or mouthwashes, sinus rinses : oregano oil, iodine, diatomaceous earth, candibactin, etc etc. But I wouldn't take them with any specific purpose, or alongside any particular diet. I would take them inconsistently and only for a short amount of time. I would quickly give up, claiming they "didn't work". In all of this LAZINESS I continued to accept misery. It was easier to give up than to fully commit to something that may not work. I was afraid of failure. I was so depressed and full of self-hatred that I didn't love myself enough to give it everything I had. I was addicted to sugar and carbs and relied on caffeine and alcohol to cope. I continued all of this even though deep down I KNEW it made it worse. I continued to self-sabotage myself in this way for nearly a decade. It is hard to treat yourself with love and health when deep down you hate yourself and the body you live in. I know. But once you wake up and start trying to truly heal it feels AMAZING.
Eventually, I realized that my issue is fungal. Despite every test telling me otherwise. That is another important point. You should see doctors and get tests run to try to find the problem but take them with a grain of salt. No test is 100% accurate. I have tested negative for candida in stool and in a culture swab ran by a doctor. But when I got a Bristle test done, it said I had low rates of halitosis but HIGH rates of multiple candida species. I ignored my negative culture swab, I ignored my negative stool test and ignored my antibody blood test that showed I had a reaction to an acute candida albicans but NOT a long term infection. I took a risk that this was the problem based off of those Bristle tests alone and I am so glad I did.
I joined the candida subreddit and found it to be a breath of fresh air compared to this subreddit. Here, we are so confused, so frustrated and so hopeless. It is understandable as we try so many things only for them not work, and our 1 problem is a symptom of many different things. Realistically, we are all trying to treat different conditions. Most importantly, we are DESPERATE, and so we try one thing and then when it doesn't work we quickly move on to the next thing because we "don't have time to waste". Here, we ask each other "what have you tried?" and in the candida subreddit they ask each other "what is your protocol?"
First step is to try to find which "horse" yours may be coming from - reflux, bacteria imbalance, fungal imbalance or possible tonsil stones. 2nd step is planning and establishing a holistic protocol and complete life style change. If you want the bad breath to change, YOU have to change. Whatever you're doing now is NOT working for you.
For me, I first tried Gentian Violet. This is a purple pigment that has historically been used to treat thrush in babies. The internet will tell you it will cause cancer and should not be put in your mouth. Well, if I would have listened to that I wouldn't be where I am today. I recommend giving it a try. If it improves you symptoms, even a little your problem is most likely fungal in nature. When I put it on my tongue I did it morning, afternoon and night for 3-4 days. It nearly completely relieved my symptoms -- I suddenly had saliva in my mouth, my tongue felt smooth instead of dry and scratchy, the tongue coating was going away etc. But as soon as I stopped taking it, it all came back. This is to be expected. A 9 year INFECTION, because that's what it is, is not going to go away overnight. So I came up with a full protocol that I have fully committed (to the best of my human ability) to ever since. Yours will probably look different to mine -- the most important thing is that you cannot HALF ASS HEALING. You're not going to heal if you only focus on supplements, or only focus on food, or only follow it 3/4 of the time.
I see I have been rambling for a long time, so perhaps I will speak more on this and the important of lifestyle/mindset changes later.
Here is MY protocol that has helped alleviate so many symptoms.
The sticky mucus/biofilm coming from my nose and sticking in my throat has completely DISAPPEARED, the last few days the bad taste in my mouth is basically gone, the tongue coating is still there lightly but it is a different type of coating than I had before. I asked a family member to be a smell reference for me and they, and a doctor has told me they smell nothing. I went on a date and they did not reject me yet , so that's promising.
1: IMO this is the most important factor. Part of me wonders if I would have seen results even if this is the only thing I changed. I finally took the plunge and began the carnivore diet. This allows you to be fully SUSTAINED while intaking NOTHING that will feed the bad bacteria or fungus. It allows you to live life enjoyably while eating no sugar, and no carbs. There are many people with candida who continue to eat veggies, low sugar and fruits and some carbs. It is no wonder they continue to suffer for MONTHS. Every time you eat any form of sugar, whether it be lactose, fructose, sucralose or artificial sweeteners you are FEEDING your smell. I plan to make a separate post about carnivore because I think it is very intimidating, scary and "weird".
2: Biofilms/Antifungals/Vitamins
When you have a fungal or bacterial imbalance it is important you are taking both something to open up the biofilms AND kill the bad guys. This is PART of why many people will take antibiotics, feel relief and then it will immediately come back afterwards. There's no way you killed all the bad guys in 2 weeks and there were probably BILLIONS of them hiding under biofilm. This is what my day looks like.. The timing of everything is important.
8 am : --1200 mg NAC (this is a biofilm buster), it breaks up the biofilm so that the bad guys are more vulnerable. There are probably lots of better ones but it was on sale near me.
-- Vitamins for immune system: zinc (50mg), Vitamin C, Vitamin D (10,000 IUD) and B vitamins
9 am: (1 hour after biofilm busters) If taking antibacterial or antifungal herbs it is important you are cycling them, as your body quickly learns how to become resistant to them. I try to take 2 natural antifungals for 5 days and then I switch to 2 different ones. Some of the ones I have tried include: wormwood, grapefruit seed extract, oregano oil, berberine, Caprylic acid, Undeclylenic acid (these last 2 were game changers I think). I also got Nystatin which is prescription antifungal off the internet (as no doctors would prescribe to me). I take one internally and chew one and let it sit on my tongue. (I also swallow 2 undecylenic acids and chew 2 swallow). I added in the chewing only a week ago and it has made the world of a difference. You have to treat the gut AND the mouth. Every once in a while I was use gentian violet again to really kick its butt.
10 am: Breakfast (it is important you wait an hour after antifungals to eat).
Once I eat, I wait at least 2 hours to take anything else.
I repeat this cycle 3 times per day, morning, afternoon and night.
At night I have started also taking some supplements that are good for gut health: slippery elm, triphala and l glutamine. Many people also struggling with candida say it is important not to eat fermented foods or take probiotics until 90% of your symptoms are gone. Fermented foods can make problems worse. However, I am going to try to add in fermented coconut probiotics soon and see if it helps my gut now that most of my worst symptoms are gone.
I have been following this protocol for nearly 2 MONTHS (nystatin and undecylenic acid and Caprylic acid was added in about 2 weeks ago). I didn't really see big improvements until a month in. Our bodies are incredibly sick and healing takes TIME and effort. Everything I have been doing has been expensive, difficult and time consuming but the other night I realized just how normal I am starting to feel and I broke down sobbing. For years I thought I would be plagued by this forever and I am finally starting to trust that I am going to heal and be okay. All the work has been worth it.
My problem may not be your exact problem, but I think most of our problems are rooted in the microbiome. Either way, the most important is to have a clear comprehensive plan (focusing on supplements, diet, mindset, mental health etc). and stick to it.